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HK1837 Offline
#61 Posted : Thursday, 1 April 2021 8:59:02 AM(UTC)
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I remember when I used to buy them as drive/tow cars, the HJ 5.0L cars were the best especially when you found a 3.08 rear axle example. The extra 34hp compared to HX and HZ made a big difference in the TH400 examples. They were great tow cars. I never had a chance to try a HJ Ambulance pack cab-chassis 5.0L, these had a 3.36 rear axle which would have made them far quicker with the 250hp engine. The best tow car would have been 350 HQ Statesman with optional 3.08 rear axle but I never bought one of those as a drive car, only a standard Deville with 308.
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Dr Terry Offline
#62 Posted : Thursday, 1 April 2021 9:09:12 AM(UTC)
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Yeah, back in the early 80s I had a 2nd hand HJ 308 TH499 Prem Wagon. It was a great towcar & a good allrounder. The only thing it missed was 4-wheel disc brakes.

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Dr Terry Offline
#63 Posted : Thursday, 1 April 2021 9:09:34 AM(UTC)
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Yeah, back in the early 80s I had a 2nd hand HJ 308 TH400 Prem Wagon. It was a great towcar & a good allrounder. The only thing it missed was 4-wheel disc brakes.

Dr Terry

Edited by user Thursday, 1 April 2021 9:11:02 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

If at first you don't succeed, just call it Version 1.0
Torana1978 Offline
#64 Posted : Thursday, 1 April 2021 10:02:55 AM(UTC)
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Thanks for answers. But why was THM350 replaced by Trimatic? Cheaper and localized?
HK1837 Offline
#65 Posted : Thursday, 1 April 2021 10:35:01 AM(UTC)
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GM stopped making the TH350 in 1981. They made the TH350-C for a while which is basically the same thing with a lockup converter (I’m putting one in my HK GTS). But is was only going to be around until 1984 and replaced by the TH700R4. I guess GMH figured they’d refined the Trimatic enough by then and the 5.0L engines at the time were nowhere near as powerful as the 250hp HJ engine that the TH400 was introduced for. Prior to that the Trimatic was good enough as the power and torque of the HT to HQ 308 was significantly lower than the HJ engine.
The only reason GMH even switched to the TH350 was GM phased out the TH400 from passenger cars for 1980 (9/79 on), so production of the passenger version would have ended earlier in 1979. They only used it in trucks then until 1990 when the 4spd TH400 arrived (4L80E). The TH400 (called 3L80 by the end of the 80’s) continued in use in Hummers and I think it is still used in military applications today.

Edited by user Thursday, 1 April 2021 10:40:37 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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castellan Offline
#66 Posted : Thursday, 1 April 2021 12:06:55 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Torana1978 Go to Quoted Post
VB/VC/VH series had THM-400 transmission as option for 5.0 or only standard THM-350? In general, was there any noticeable difference in performance between these automatic transmissions?


Both the T400 and T350 were a nice slushbox for boring people who just put it into drive and plodded about but both shocking autos to drive if you were a spirited driver who used the T Bar like a manual as back in 1968 XT Ford Falcon came out with the T Bar C4 auto that was designed for spirited drivers in mind, what a wonderful a C4 auto is to use, it responds to you demands up shifting and down shifting quickly with no fuss and you can pull it back to 1st at a good rate of speed and it will go back into 1st nicely. not to mention the Falcon T Bar gate is wonderful thing to use, but the Holden T Bar gate was designed by a moron who did not have a clue what the T Bar was truly for.

The Trimatic can handle anything that any stock 308 could muster and more, they are stronger than the Aussie 4sp manual box, not to mention that if you work a auto hard you have to put a oil cooler on any auto because heat is the main killer of autos.

The earliest Trimatics in the HG etc were fine, but for one thing the fibres in the clutches did not like running backwards as was the case when you used reverse. such was fine but for people with steep driveways where they found the problem lay after some years, so they ended up working out what the problem was, apart from that we would of never got a T 400 or T350 behind a 308.

The Tri matic has it's good points and faults, 1 the Tri matic transfers more power to the back wheels, as the T400 T350 rob you more in such a regard.
The only down side of the Tri matic is that the bastard does not lock out 1st or 2ed gear from being selected by mistake at high speed, so it can go back to 1st at 200km/h. but the good thing is that you can select 1st on demand when needed to respond to your needs instantly, but a T400-T350 from factory only go back to 1st at around 30km/h what a horrific blight auto they are to have such a displeasure to drive such a boring Auto. if I did not know any better I would throw a match in such a car to be done with such a blighted auto transmission. no wonder people hatted automatics back in the days, if you bought a auto trans GTS or T Bar GT Falcon people thought you were queer or surely not a serious driving person.

On the other hand you can make a T400-T350 into a good responding auto, but never as good as a Ford C4. with the C4 you will not get back protest responses from your demands at all and that makes the C4 King of autos. Ford FMX and C6 and B/W are all rubbish just as T400-T350 are all called slushboxes. boring power robbing miserable things to drive with any real enthusiasm.
HK1837 Offline
#67 Posted : Thursday, 1 April 2021 12:41:59 PM(UTC)
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TH400 was put in as the 308 became too powerful in HJ, simple as that. GM had specific torque figures vs vehicle weight at which they changed to a different transmission and rear axle. The reason HQ got a TH400 not a TH350 is the 4BBL L48 had more torque than the maximum torque allowed in that size vehicle. I have never had a hydraulic controlled auto drive better than a TH400, they are bulletproof and shift fine when they are new. If you wanted to change gears manually you bought a manual.
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castellan Offline
#68 Posted : Friday, 2 April 2021 10:37:25 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: HK1837 Go to Quoted Post
TH400 was put in as the 308 became too powerful in HJ, simple as that. GM had specific torque figures vs vehicle weight at which they changed to a different transmission and rear axle. The reason HQ got a TH400 not a TH350 is the 4BBL L48 had more torque than the maximum torque allowed in that size vehicle. I have never had a hydraulic controlled auto drive better than a TH400, they are bulletproof and shift fine when they are new. If you wanted to change gears manually you bought a manual.


The HJ 308 ? HJ ute and P van only got a single exhaust and was gutless as.
The 308 LH Torana from 10/74 to 6/76 got a tri matic and banjo diff.
A HX-Z, LX, VB, WB, VC, VH, VK, VL 5.0L V8 with a Automatic could not pull a sailor off ya sister. even a VK EFI 3.3L can hose them all off.

The T400-T350 was dopey power robing auto that kicked down was slow to respond right from new, it was no performance auto.

I seen a test of a 1975-6 ? Pontiac 455 T400 auto that came to Australia and they commented on the performance of the auto in how this T400 was responding so much better than all the other T400 in other cars they had ever driven, so it was modified to complement a enthusiast driver behind the wheel, now it was not C4 but this one was better than our HJ boring T400.

Most people are that stupid that they think that a auto is only about taking off and holding it flat through 1st to 2ed and top, well the T400 does that just fine. but the thing is if you can truly drive a car you use the T Bar for good reason, as such you will pull it back into 2ed on some fast corners so you are set to respond much better to throttle commands, this keeps one it total control and also you are not having to second guess if it's going to drop back into 2ed or not and not to mention the slow to responding kick down drive you up the wall and on sharper corners you want to drop it back to 1st at 60KM/H or so to hang the arse out even coming out of the corner or to control the rear coming into a corner and then nailing it on just the right spot setting the tail up for the job on hand with such precision. it's all about being able to control the car to your demands.

As I pointed out Ford has the same shocking dull responding autos as well like the FMX and C6, when the XT GT came out the Auto was magic thing to use because it was a C4 automatic and when the XW GT came out they were making claims that this auto was going to be modified to respond like the C4, but it did not live up to that greatness at all, as it was only a FMX auto and test drivers were bitterly disappointed in it.
If you have ever driven a XW-Y-A 4sp manual you would know that they were a pain to change gears with when changing fast hooking in all day long, it felt as tho I had been punching people all day long with that hand. and when I got a XB T Bar ute with a C4 auto that was behind a 351 with only a 2 barrel carby mind you from factory, so with the torque of the 351 you did not need a 4sp at all, I was like f that 4sp junk this is the only way to travel, it did everything you wanted it to do, I could not complain at all, apart from them XA-B-C being rust buckets.
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#69 Posted : Friday, 2 April 2021 8:32:02 PM(UTC)
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All 308/5.0L were standard with single exhaust until HX. Torana had a dual exhaust but it was a tiny system, the combined cross sectional area of the twin pipes was barely more than a single 2” system that was in the Holdens. However that is irrelevant to the transmission application, it was based upon the GM20 (SAE Gross) test figures and the vehicle mass. Torana got a Trimatic behind 5.0L as it was a far lighter car, same reason it got a nodular banjo rather than the Salisbury as fitted to a Holden or Statesman.

Almost all those cars mentioned as slow were almost all 2.6/2.78/3.08 rear axles. They weren’t designed for performance. The exception would be a pre 6/76 LX auto 5.0L, a VK EFI wouldn’t even come close! Those LX have the same rear axle ratio for manual and auto and they were very quick cars, even with a standard exhaust. One of the HZ or VB 5.0L auto cars with dual exhaust and a performance rear axle (3.36) were also pretty quick given what they were.

The TH400 is an extremely strong transmission, no bands, full clutch packs and heavy duty gear support. They shift really well with minimal mods, but so do TH350 or Trimatic. A TH400 does use 8hp more than a TH350, however they handle a lot more abuse. I’ve had them in heaps of different cars including a SBC conversion into an MQ Patrol. Very crisp box, you just have to remove the factory calibration to crispen up the shifts, but most factory auto are like that. Really only the factory big block versions were modded for performance shifts. If you look at the calibration of the 427 ZL1 boxes or the LS6 Chevelles they are very different to a soft shifting Statesman box.
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castellan Offline
#70 Posted : Saturday, 3 April 2021 11:10:15 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: HK1837 Go to Quoted Post
All 308/5.0L were standard with single exhaust until HX. Torana had a dual exhaust but it was a tiny system, the combined cross sectional area of the twin pipes was barely more than a single 2” system that was in the Holdens. However that is irrelevant to the transmission application, it was based upon the GM20 (SAE Gross) test figures and the vehicle mass. Torana got a Trimatic behind 5.0L as it was a far lighter car, same reason it got a nodular banjo rather than the Salisbury as fitted to a Holden or Statesman.

Almost all those cars mentioned as slow were almost all 2.6/2.78/3.08 rear axles. They weren’t designed for performance. The exception would be a pre 6/76 LX auto 5.0L, a VK EFI wouldn’t even come close! Those LX have the same rear axle ratio for manual and auto and they were very quick cars, even with a standard exhaust. One of the HZ or VB 5.0L auto cars with dual exhaust and a performance rear axle (3.36) were also pretty quick given what they were.

The TH400 is an extremely strong transmission, no bands, full clutch packs and heavy duty gear support. They shift really well with minimal mods, but so do TH350 or Trimatic. A TH400 does use 8hp more than a TH350, however they handle a lot more abuse. I’ve had them in heaps of different cars including a SBC conversion into an MQ Patrol. Very crisp box, you just have to remove the factory calibration to crispen up the shifts, but most factory auto are like that. Really only the factory big block versions were modded for performance shifts. If you look at the calibration of the 427 ZL1 boxes or the LS6 Chevelles they are very different to a soft shifting Statesman box.


My SL/R 5000 was 3.08 with 14in wheels and I as sure as hell would not want to go lower ration diff as it valve bounced at 200km/h and I put a 2.78 in it and it was fine, plenty of grunt to use that ratio easy as, but I liked the 3.08 better and at 100km/h going back to 3rd the back wheels would hop losing traction with 245 tyres. sure it had a 650 DP and extractors and a stock recon engine I believe. but running 3.36 ratio would be down right stupid even with 14in wheels. and we all know that a banjo diff behind any 308 is crap I knew people who carried a spare banjo and axel in the boot and had it down pat as to how fast they could change the diff out on the side of the road.

As to the T400 The shifting up is not the problem at all. it's the sifting down that takes to long, they call it same day reaction. and then it's also about when the bastard will drop back ? well that's that point it will not drop back even if you use the T Bar, try dropping back to 1st over 30KM/H Eh? nothing it will not pick up 1st d'oh! Applause boring.

A tri matic can be made to handle 600hp.

It's not about the hard shifting up of the box as I hate that if it's to hard, I remember a aunty with XM Falcon 200 super pursuit 2sp auto and boy the bang into 2ed was shockingly hard.
My sisters HK Premier 186 auto would flair badly sometimes into 2ed and it only had 60.000 miles up on it driven by a old bloke who went into a nursing home.
Smitty2 Offline
#71 Posted : Saturday, 3 April 2021 5:17:28 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: HK1837 Go to Quoted Post
All 308/5.0L were standard with single exhaust until HX. Torana had a dual exhaust but it was a tiny system, the combined cross sectional area of the twin pipes was barely more than a single 2” system that was in the Holdens. However that is irrelevant to the transmission application, it was based upon the GM20 (SAE Gross) test figures and the vehicle mass. Torana got a Trimatic behind 5.0L as it was a far lighter car, same reason it got a nodular banjo rather than the Salisbury as fitted to a Holden or Statesman.

Almost all those cars mentioned as slow were almost all 2.6/2.78/3.08 rear axles. They weren’t designed for performance. The exception would be a pre 6/76 LX auto 5.0L, a VK EFI wouldn’t even come close! Those LX have the same rear axle ratio for manual and auto and they were very quick cars, even with a standard exhaust. One of the HZ or VB 5.0L auto cars with dual exhaust and a performance rear axle (3.36) were also pretty quick given what they were.

The TH400 is an extremely strong transmission, no bands, full clutch packs and heavy duty gear support. They shift really well with minimal mods, but so do TH350 or Trimatic. A TH400 does use 8hp more than a TH350, however they handle a lot more abuse. I’ve had them in heaps of different cars including a SBC conversion into an MQ Patrol. Very crisp box, you just have to remove the factory calibration to crispen up the shifts, but most factory auto are like that. Really only the factory big block versions were modded for performance shifts. If you look at the calibration of the 427 ZL1 boxes or the LS6 Chevelles they are very different to a soft shifting Statesman box.


"All 308/5.0L were standard with single exhaust until HX"??? sure?

my next door neighbour had a HG ute.. 308 with saginaw
bought new ... it had dual exhaust into 'across' style rear muffler with 4 outlets (like Monaros)
made luvverly noises too ...
also
I had a 2nd hand HQ Kingswood sedan (bought 2nd hand from Reg Hunt) .. 308 / M21 with dual pipes
(just like the GTS sedans I thought at the time)






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HK1837 Offline
#72 Posted : Saturday, 3 April 2021 6:29:46 PM(UTC)
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You missed the key word Smitty - STANDARD. N10 dual exhaust was available as an option on lots of V8 Holden, but was only standard on GTS327 and GTS350 until HQ SS, but it wasn’t a 5.0L. HX GTS was standard with dual exhaust this it was the first Holden to get dual exhaust standard with a 5.0L. About the only place you couldn’t option N10 was HQ-WB commercial, and the jury is out on HQ-HZ wagon and Statesman, evidence of those exist but not in where it counts like order procedures or POA documents. I can’t recall if any Brougham could be had with N10 either.

Edited by user Saturday, 3 April 2021 6:55:22 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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castellan Offline
#73 Posted : Saturday, 3 April 2021 8:33:56 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: HK1837 Go to Quoted Post
You missed the key word Smitty - STANDARD. N10 dual exhaust was available as an option on lots of V8 Holden, but was only standard on GTS327 and GTS350 until HQ SS, but it wasn’t a 5.0L. HX GTS was standard with dual exhaust this it was the first Holden to get dual exhaust standard with a 5.0L. About the only place you couldn’t option N10 was HQ-WB commercial, and the jury is out on HQ-HZ wagon and Statesman, evidence of those exist but not in where it counts like order procedures or POA documents. I can’t recall if any Brougham could be had with N10 either.


I am sure that no dual exhaust was on the Broughams at all, such was not fitting in with the whole concept at the time to make such a car the quietest car in the world. them HK-T-G GTS mufflers were not as quiet as the HQ duel exhaust and I have 204hp DIN from a South African HG GTS308 and 196hp NET from a HQ 308 with N10 dual exhaust due to such being more restricted.


I am sure that the HZ Statesman had duel exhaust standard as a bloke I worked with his was dual pipes from new.
Next door old man had a HX Statesman with duals exhaust looked factory.

I think that the HQ N10 had smaller tail pipes then the HX-Z did. I am sure they were LH Torana size tail pipes.

Look at the tail pipe of the HQ 202 I think they were the same size as the N10.

Look at the HQ-J-X-Z 202 they were all small and then the 202 Commodore came out the tail pipe was bigger and look at the WB ute with 3.3L they had a much bigger diameter tail pipe than the HQ 202.

I am sure that the HQ-J-X-Z V8 single was bigger diameter than the 202 but not as big as the WB 3.3L ute I think that the 4.2L WB ute was the same diameter as the WB 3.3L.

look at the HK-T-G 6 CYL exhaust they are more restricted than the HQ 6 CYL.

look at the HD-R X2 and 186s the wagon and ute P van tail pipe is bigger diameter than the sedan gets, I think that they get the V8 diameter tail pipe. maybe such is because the Premier sedan in that they are trying to keep the noise down.

I do not remember any HQ-J-X-Z wagon with dual pipes being factory N10.

I believe that the HQ 350 Statesman came out with a single but could be optioned dual.
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#74 Posted : Saturday, 3 April 2021 8:53:57 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Smitty2 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: HK1837 Go to Quoted Post
All 308/5.0L were standard with single exhaust until HX. Torana had a dual exhaust but it was a tiny system, the combined cross sectional area of the twin pipes was barely more than a single 2” system that was in the Holdens. However that is irrelevant to the transmission application, it was based upon the GM20 (SAE Gross) test figures and the vehicle mass. Torana got a Trimatic behind 5.0L as it was a far lighter car, same reason it got a nodular banjo rather than the Salisbury as fitted to a Holden or Statesman.

Almost all those cars mentioned as slow were almost all 2.6/2.78/3.08 rear axles. They weren’t designed for performance. The exception would be a pre 6/76 LX auto 5.0L, a VK EFI wouldn’t even come close! Those LX have the same rear axle ratio for manual and auto and they were very quick cars, even with a standard exhaust. One of the HZ or VB 5.0L auto cars with dual exhaust and a performance rear axle (3.36) were also pretty quick given what they were.

The TH400 is an extremely strong transmission, no bands, full clutch packs and heavy duty gear support. They shift really well with minimal mods, but so do TH350 or Trimatic. A TH400 does use 8hp more than a TH350, however they handle a lot more abuse. I’ve had them in heaps of different cars including a SBC conversion into an MQ Patrol. Very crisp box, you just have to remove the factory calibration to crispen up the shifts, but most factory auto are like that. Really only the factory big block versions were modded for performance shifts. If you look at the calibration of the 427 ZL1 boxes or the LS6 Chevelles they are very different to a soft shifting Statesman box.


"All 308/5.0L were standard with single exhaust until HX"??? sure?

my next door neighbour had a HG ute.. 308 with saginaw
bought new ... it had dual exhaust into 'across' style rear muffler with 4 outlets (like Monaros)
made luvverly noises too ...
also
I had a 2nd hand HQ Kingswood sedan (bought 2nd hand from Reg Hunt) .. 308 / M21 with dual pipes
(just like the GTS sedans I thought at the time)







I have never seen the GTS Quad pipes on the HK-T-G utes or P vans, I thought that the spare Tyre box would get in the way of such a thing.
Would look cool tho.
I never seen anyone with a V8 HK-T-G go get a factory dual setup with quad pipes as they cost too much I am sure and I am sure that no after market exhaust made such a muffler for them.
The house one over next door had a Son with a dark green HG GTS350 back in 1973 with them quad pipes and he would always give it some stick so I remember the sound of them that they made.
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#75 Posted : Sunday, 4 April 2021 11:47:23 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: castellan Go to Quoted Post

The house one over next door had a Son with a dark green HG GTS350 back in 1973 with them quad pipes and he would always give it some stick so I remember the sound of them that they made.


them 4 pipe outlets made me go out and buy a 2ndhand HT GTS 350 manual.. yeah with factory 4 pipe outlet exhaust
set of extractors ..and removal of the centre mufflers and it sounded awesome
.. especially on the over run Applause

looked nice with 'American' racing mags


Edited by user Sunday, 4 April 2021 11:48:11 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Club circuit racing...the best fun you can have with your pants on
HK1837 Offline
#76 Posted : Sunday, 4 April 2021 11:56:03 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: castellan Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: HK1837 Go to Quoted Post
You missed the key word Smitty - STANDARD. N10 dual exhaust was available as an option on lots of V8 Holden, but was only standard on GTS327 and GTS350 until HQ SS, but it wasn’t a 5.0L. HX GTS was standard with dual exhaust this it was the first Holden to get dual exhaust standard with a 5.0L. About the only place you couldn’t option N10 was HQ-WB commercial, and the jury is out on HQ-HZ wagon and Statesman, evidence of those exist but not in where it counts like order procedures or POA documents. I can’t recall if any Brougham could be had with N10 either.


I am sure that no dual exhaust was on the Broughams at all, such was not fitting in with the whole concept at the time to make such a car the quietest car in the world. them HK-T-G GTS mufflers were not as quiet as the HQ duel exhaust and I have 204hp DIN from a South African HG GTS308 and 196hp NET from a HQ 308 with N10 dual exhaust due to such being more restricted.


I am sure that the HZ Statesman had duel exhaust standard as a bloke I worked with his was dual pipes from new.
Next door old man had a HX Statesman with duals exhaust looked factory.

I think that the HQ N10 had smaller tail pipes then the HX-Z did. I am sure they were LH Torana size tail pipes.

Look at the tail pipe of the HQ 202 I think they were the same size as the N10.

Look at the HQ-J-X-Z 202 they were all small and then the 202 Commodore came out the tail pipe was bigger and look at the WB ute with 3.3L they had a much bigger diameter tail pipe than the HQ 202.

I am sure that the HQ-J-X-Z V8 single was bigger diameter than the 202 but not as big as the WB 3.3L ute I think that the 4.2L WB ute was the same diameter as the WB 3.3L.

look at the HK-T-G 6 CYL exhaust they are more restricted than the HQ 6 CYL.

look at the HD-R X2 and 186s the wagon and ute P van tail pipe is bigger diameter than the sedan gets, I think that they get the V8 diameter tail pipe. maybe such is because the Premier sedan in that they are trying to keep the noise down.

I do not remember any HQ-J-X-Z wagon with dual pipes being factory N10.

I believe that the HQ 350 Statesman came out with a single but could be optioned dual.


I just checked the POA docs and the following is in there:

HQ - N10 Standard only on 81837, XV2 (SS) and XW8 (GTS350 sedan). Only available on XV4 (GTS sedan), 80269, 80437, 80469, 81269 with L31 engine and PK6 or QEV tyres (both ER70H14). Only available on 81237 or 81669 (V8 Statesman) with L30 or L31 with PK6 or QEV tyres. Revised in early 1974 that no dual exhaust with canister fitted cars (must be export only or trial?). So the ONLY place you could get dual exhaust on a HQ 253 was on SS.

HJ - N10 now available with L31, L32 or L33. Only on Belmont, Kingswood and Premier sedans, LS coupe, GTS sedan, GTS coupe and Caprice. Not available with canister fitted cars. Limited tyre choices again.

HX - N10 Standard on GTS. Available with 4.2 or 5.0L only on Belmont, Kingswood or Premier sedans. Limited tyre choices again.

HZ - N10 Standard on GTS, Deville and Caprice. Available with 4.2 and 5.0L on Kingswood and Premier sedan and wagon, however it appears only to have been available on wagon after release of XT5 engines and this appears to be recorded March 1979. They may be referring to the modified red V8 engines around VB release?


All the dual exhaust fitted from HQ to HZ were 2" pipes with a step down to a smaller 1.875" muffler. The single systems on V8 were 2" with the same step down muffler. HQ-HZ 6cyl used 1.875" pipe at the front and a 1.625" tailpipe. There were additional resonators on HZ Statesman with dual exhaust which also used larger mufflers (presume proper 2" in and out).

N10 was priced for all HK-HG, but appears in the HK POA as not available outside 81837. Sizing for HK is 1.875" for 6cyl (except GTS) with 1.5" tailpipe. 307 and GTS (186S) was 2" pipe with 1.75" tailpipes. N10 was all 2". HT-HG only changes so that all 186S (not just GTS) get the 2" pipes with 1.75" tailpipes.

HR were 1.875" pipe with tailpipes at 1.759" for the front bit and 1.5" for the rear. 186S 2" pipe with 1.875" for the front bit dropping to 1.75" at the rear (except 215A/225A/235A with 186S used a 1.5" rear of tailpipe.

HD was 1.75" pipe with 1.5" tailpipe. X2 used 1.87" tailpipes, it doesn't give the pipe size at the front.

Edited by user Sunday, 4 April 2021 4:13:37 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords?
HK1837 Offline
#77 Posted : Sunday, 4 April 2021 12:33:16 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: castellan Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: Smitty2 Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: HK1837 Go to Quoted Post
All 308/5.0L were standard with single exhaust until HX. Torana had a dual exhaust but it was a tiny system, the combined cross sectional area of the twin pipes was barely more than a single 2” system that was in the Holdens. However that is irrelevant to the transmission application, it was based upon the GM20 (SAE Gross) test figures and the vehicle mass. Torana got a Trimatic behind 5.0L as it was a far lighter car, same reason it got a nodular banjo rather than the Salisbury as fitted to a Holden or Statesman.

Almost all those cars mentioned as slow were almost all 2.6/2.78/3.08 rear axles. They weren’t designed for performance. The exception would be a pre 6/76 LX auto 5.0L, a VK EFI wouldn’t even come close! Those LX have the same rear axle ratio for manual and auto and they were very quick cars, even with a standard exhaust. One of the HZ or VB 5.0L auto cars with dual exhaust and a performance rear axle (3.36) were also pretty quick given what they were.

The TH400 is an extremely strong transmission, no bands, full clutch packs and heavy duty gear support. They shift really well with minimal mods, but so do TH350 or Trimatic. A TH400 does use 8hp more than a TH350, however they handle a lot more abuse. I’ve had them in heaps of different cars including a SBC conversion into an MQ Patrol. Very crisp box, you just have to remove the factory calibration to crispen up the shifts, but most factory auto are like that. Really only the factory big block versions were modded for performance shifts. If you look at the calibration of the 427 ZL1 boxes or the LS6 Chevelles they are very different to a soft shifting Statesman box.


"All 308/5.0L were standard with single exhaust until HX"??? sure?

my next door neighbour had a HG ute.. 308 with saginaw
bought new ... it had dual exhaust into 'across' style rear muffler with 4 outlets (like Monaros)
made luvverly noises too ...
also
I had a 2nd hand HQ Kingswood sedan (bought 2nd hand from Reg Hunt) .. 308 / M21 with dual pipes
(just like the GTS sedans I thought at the time)







I have never seen the GTS Quad pipes on the HK-T-G utes or P vans, I thought that the spare Tyre box would get in the way of such a thing.
Would look cool tho.
I never seen anyone with a V8 HK-T-G go get a factory dual setup with quad pipes as they cost too much I am sure and I am sure that no after market exhaust made such a muffler for them.
The house one over next door had a Son with a dark green HG GTS350 back in 1973 with them quad pipes and he would always give it some stick so I remember the sound of them that they made.


Commercials used the same rear muffler as passenger in HK-HG l, no reason why the N10 system wouldn’t be a straight bolt up. All the GMH exhausts were made by the aftermarket, so you could get any of it from the OEM back in the day. I very much doubt you’d have gotten an assembly plant fitted N10 on a commercial though unless it was a very special order.
I recently bought a Gibson stainless muffler for my HK, virtually the same dimensions just needs the hangers welded on. They come in 4x2.25” or 4x2.5”. I’ll be running twin 2.5 all the way from the Corvette Ramshorns through 2.5” stainless resonators to the rear muffler, then I have to alter a set of the outlets to make them fit into the 2.25” muffler outlets

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If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords?
Sandaro Offline
#78 Posted : Monday, 5 April 2021 8:12:02 PM(UTC)
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Smitty, the HT looks awesome, what colour? The sound of the quad pipes is an awesome thing!!
 1 user thanked Sandaro for this useful post.
Smitty2 on 6/04/2021(UTC)
Smitty2 Offline
#79 Posted : Tuesday, 6 April 2021 8:36:51 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Sandaro Go to Quoted Post
Smitty, the HT looks awesome, what colour? The sound of the quad pipes is an awesome thing!!


silver... think it was called Platinum silver on HTs
(someone please correct me if wrong)



here is a colour pic of this (of another GTS350, not mine)

Edited by user Tuesday, 6 April 2021 8:39:55 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Club circuit racing...the best fun you can have with your pants on
HK1837 Offline
#80 Posted : Tuesday, 6 April 2021 9:57:54 AM(UTC)
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Platinum metallic.

Do you have an old engine or chassis number for it Smitty? If you do we may be able to find its details for you.
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If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords?
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