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Matt B Offline
#1 Posted : Tuesday, 1 December 2015 2:16:41 PM(UTC)
Matt B

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Hi,
I'm just purchasing a HQ Monaro Coupe and I would like some help with the ID tags if possible. Please see below for the information I have;
Safety Compliance Plate - Holden HQ Couple,
12/72,
CHQ 60438S (this matches the chassis number)

Body Identification Plate - Model - 80337QR (Monaro Coupe 6cly?)
Body – 60374-S
Trim – 1845-21E (Monaro 1971-1972 Antique Saddle/Brown)
Paint – 567-13887 (Patina Gold Metallic?)
Top – (No number?)
ENG L20 – (202 motor)
Trans M40 – (Trimatic)
RRAXLE G95 – (?)
General Motors Holdens PTY LTD – 8N37LCH754805Q
8 – (GM Division, Australian Holden)
N – (Luxury Code, Kingswood, Monaro)
37 – (Body code, Coupe)
L – (Engine code, 202 high comp)
C – (Year model, 1973, 1983? Does this need to match 12/72)
H7 – (Assembly plant, Sydney)
54805 – (Serial number, does this need to match?)
Q – (Series code, HQ7/71)
thanks in advance
HK1837 Offline
#2 Posted : Tuesday, 1 December 2015 2:21:31 PM(UTC)
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It is a 6cyl HQ Monaro, optioned with 202HC, trimatic and metallic paint. Probably has front discs too. Assume column shift?

1845 is Patina Gold metallic as you state.
21E is Antique Saddle/Brown vinyl on a HQ Kingswood or HQ Monaro.

It should have a number stamped into the firewall under the LH washer spray pipe, something like 604xxS
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Matt B Offline
#3 Posted : Tuesday, 1 December 2015 3:15:04 PM(UTC)
Matt B

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Thanks,
The number on the firewall is 60406 S or a 6? I am worried about the 12/72 on the safety plate does no match the C = year model 1973,1983 on the General Motors plate?
HK1837 Offline
#4 Posted : Tuesday, 1 December 2015 4:03:38 PM(UTC)
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All the numbers go together OK as far as I can tell. 60406S will be the firewall number. Not sure what you are worried about, 12/73 is a 1973 HQ. Any HQ complianced after 1st September 1972 is a 1973 HQ.

Forgot to mention , G95 under rear axle is 3.36:1 banjo. This is the standard rear axle when auto optioned on an 0337 HQ, but isn't the standard rear axle for an 0337 which is why it has a code. If it was a standard 0337 it'd be blank in all spots as it'd be a 173, 3spd column with 3.55:1 banjo rear axle.

I saw some more of your questions to:

H754805 is the Production Serial Number. You sometimes find info that breaks this up, even GMH did it themselves but that is simply silly and confusing. This number is the pivot column by which most surviving GMH records are listed so it is best left as it is. If you try to break it up like you have into a plant code and then a serial number you end up with the same serial number being used every 100000 PSN's issued.

On these cars nothing matches anything, other than the chassis number being stamped into the Safety Compliance Plate (I call it the ADR plate to make it simpler). But with enough cars recorded it is easy to see a correlation between chassis #, PSN, body number and firewall number (for Pagewood bodied cars like yours), and hence spot a car where someone has swapped tags between bodies. Yours all fits together OK given others known around it. You can see that the following numbers are close:

60406S firewall tracking number. This is the number the Pagewood plant used to track the car.
60374-S body number. This is the 60374th body to be affixed with a body tag in the Pagewood body plant. By the number you see things get out of whack slightly with the firewall number.
CHQ60438S, 60438th chassis number on a HQ at Pagewood. Pagewood chassis numbers went on in the assembly plant hence they are also screwed up relative to the other two, but still close. As can be seen others overtook this one.

Edited by user Tuesday, 1 December 2015 4:36:19 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Added more info

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If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords?
Cocko750 Offline
#5 Posted : Tuesday, 1 December 2015 5:42:22 PM(UTC)
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Nice work hk good to actually see this broken down have always wondered about the firewall stamped numbers and the difference there .
detective Offline
#6 Posted : Tuesday, 1 December 2015 6:02:32 PM(UTC)
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....the firewall tracking number may relate to the bare shell "skeleton", I'm pretty sure to potentially see if any production issues (cracks etc.) occur around a certain body shell sequence or "block", whereas the body number is actually the "body assembly number" which comprises all attached doors, boot glass and interior trim (istbc). The body assembly at that point becomes subject to warranty in house. In the corporate GM scheme of things, the GMH body plant actually "sells" the body assembly to the car production plants....hence having to warranty the body assembly.


....This applied to Holden production in 1948, and I'm pretty sure the same numbering procedure applied through the years....Cheers
HK1837 Offline
#7 Posted : Tuesday, 1 December 2015 6:46:31 PM(UTC)
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It is only a Pagewood HQ-HZ thing. Elizabeth did it on the cowl for a while into HQ. Pagewood tracked HK-HG (and earlier) through the whole assembly process by the chassis number on the firewall. The only tag on them for the almost entire assembly process was the body tag, and on Pagewood vehicles the body number was not unique as it was a cumulative total for each model (eg V8 Belmont ute, 6cyl Premier wagon) for most of HK-HG. The body tag went on after paint. Thus they used the chassis number on the firewall, this went on not long after the paint went onto the firewall in the body plant, whilst the body and paint were still hot. When HQ came around they continued to add a firewall number as the car never got a chassis number until it was in the assembly plant (as it was on the rails). This number appears on the broadcast sheet for most Pagewood. The big unknown at this stage is how they tracked Pagewood HQ-HZ vans and tonners with Elizabeth bodies as there was no firewall number. The addition of Pagewood firewall numbers stopped at VB Commodore production start, but by that time the PSN was the body number so they'd just have changed to tracking by that, again other than for imported ute and van bodies from Elizabeth - however these had "black hole" or "ghost" Elizabeth PSN's on their body plates also so they may have used the Ghost Elizabeth PSN for tracking. I say Ghost as at Elizabeth from 8/77 the Body number matches the numerical part of the PSN on an Elizabeth vehicle, but the number on Pagewood or Dandenong vans and tonners never existed as a whole PSN as Elizabeth never scheduled assembly of a vehicle with that PSN. However the number still appears on a body plate as it went on in the Elizabeth body plant before the painted and hard trimmed bodies were exported to Pagewood and Dandenong for assembly (could be some Acacia Ridge tonners too but I've never found one).
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If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords?
Matt B Offline
#8 Posted : Wednesday, 2 December 2015 9:09:37 AM(UTC)
Matt B

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Thanks to all especially HK1837, I will be a proud owner of a HQ Monaro and I will be gathering as much information about the car as I can to keep with it.
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