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ExportHolden Offline
#21 Posted : Wednesday, 13 April 2016 4:52:25 PM(UTC)
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Trim is 1959 - 63T on the Body plate if that helps. Def two colours going on there, three if you include the dark brown carpet...

castellan Offline
#22 Posted : Wednesday, 13 April 2016 5:01:29 PM(UTC)
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Is this car a Aussie car and not an exported car ?

Such Statesman's were given to abo's with government jobs with 253 manuals and 308 manuals as well in the HQ and even a 202 I seen that one teacher had. this was back in the early 70's.

The abo's got a lot of new cars given to them in QLD when old Joh was Premer.
There must of been some sort of deals done some how, when anyone try's to find out what it was all about the QLD ALP went running around like a total mental case trying to shut everything up saying, that we have no rights to know this or that and even threatened anyone who wanted to know.
My full blood abo mates said they did not pay one cent for them as far as they know, as the Government gave it to them just like they did with the Houses.

So I would say it may be one of them type of cars the government orders, don't think anyone in the public could order such a car from the dealer. I know that a dealer would go of there rocker if you tried to order such a Statesman as it would be bad for resale and lower the resale values and so one and on.
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griffo on 11/05/2016(UTC)
wbute Offline
#23 Posted : Wednesday, 13 April 2016 8:21:49 PM(UTC)
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It's not Oyster is it?
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#24 Posted : Wednesday, 11 May 2016 2:20:35 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: castellan Go to Quoted Post
Is this car a Aussie car and not an exported car ?

Such Statesman's were given to abo's with government jobs with 253 manuals and 308 manuals as well in the HQ and even a 202 I seen that one teacher had. this was back in the early 70's.

The abo's got a lot of new cars given to them in QLD when old Joh was Premer.
There must of been some sort of deals done some how, when anyone try's to find out what it was all about the QLD ALP went running around like a total mental case trying to shut everything up saying, that we have no rights to know this or that and even threatened anyone who wanted to know.
My full blood abo mates said they did not pay one cent for them as far as they know, as the Government gave it to them just like they did with the Houses.

So I would say it may be one of them type of cars the government orders, don't think anyone in the public could order such a car from the dealer. I know that a dealer would go of there rocker if you tried to order such a Statesman as it would be bad for resale and lower the resale values and so one and on.




Shame on you Applause LOL LOL
Lingus Offline
#25 Posted : Wednesday, 14 September 2016 9:06:02 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: ExportHolden Go to Quoted Post
I've just bought an Oct 84-build WB DeVille Series II with bench front seat and column shift. I've seen two others like this over the years and like mine they had the VC-VK Commodore two-spoke steering wheel, instead of the single spoke wheel on five-seat DeVille and Caprice. I'm pretty sure this is factory -- it's in the WB parts manual.

Does anyone know why Holden put the VC-VK wheel on? Why not the single spoke -- or the two-spoke wheel used on WB commercials?



Getting back to the original question in this thread, I would suggest that the factory's choice of steering wheel has everything to do with the column-mounted shift lever ... I'm referring here to the relationship of a driver's left hand, both to the wheel and the shift lever.

Ideally for a column shift configuration, the steering wheel should be rigid and circular, neither of which is a characteristic of the standard Statesman single-spoke item. Also, the rim of the wheel should be positioned comfortably to the end of the shift arm.

It's a while since I've driven a column auto of any kind, but my habit of old was to hook my thumb on the wheel rim to operate the shift lever.
Jet Offline
#26 Posted : Monday, 19 September 2016 9:20:28 AM(UTC)
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I have an wb ute with same trim, mine has vinyl seats. After plenty of searching it seems the trim codes and colours for wb were different. Even code numbers the same from earlier models dont match
Add to this some random application of parts in last production runs you see a few odd combinations
HK1837 Offline
#27 Posted : Monday, 19 September 2016 9:52:34 AM(UTC)
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The reason WB changed is because Commodore and Calais changed over the WB series model run from early 1980 through to early 1985. During this time VC became VH became VK. No different to later Holden ute, it changed trim with Commodore/Calais. Just look at VS Holden ute, once VS passenger vehicles ceased and VT and VX appeared VS Holden ute changed trim accordingly. Even in earlier series, at or soon after LX Torana release HJ trim all changed across the range not just in commercials. Even HK changed when HB Torana changed, and vice versa, at the HQ-HJ series interface LH Torana trim all changed from HQ to HJ trim.
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ExportHolden Offline
#28 Posted : Monday, 19 September 2016 4:31:37 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: HK1837 Go to Quoted Post
The reason WB changed is because Commodore and Calais changed over the WB series model run from early 1980 through to early 1985. During this time VC became VH became VK. No different to later Holden ute, it changed trim with Commodore/Calais. Just look at VS Holden ute, once VS passenger vehicles ceased and VT and VX appeared VS Holden ute changed trim accordingly. Even in earlier series, at or soon after LX Torana release HJ trim all changed across the range not just in commercials. Even HK changed when HB Torana changed, and vice versa, at the HQ-HJ series interface LH Torana trim all changed from HQ to HJ trim.


I've noticed that the trim on WB DeVille Series II varied between the scratchy tweed wool-look cloth in mine and a velour that looks a lot like the velour I had in a VK Calais. I wish mine was the velour...

Finding a few more parts unique to the column shift WB Stato. Have a perfect under-column panel to replace mine (that has random drill holes through it) only to discover that the recess for the ashtray in mine is a completely different shape to the floor shift WB (which was a storage tray, I think). Buggar...

After I've tidied mine up a bit more, I want to take to the Funeral Directors who originally bought it, if they're interested. The bloke who runs the place looks like he'd be old enough to remember it. It'd be cool to know if they know about some parts on it and what they were for (eg a brass blank on the leading edge of the bonnet on the centre crease, an extra round hole — as if for an aerial — on the right guard, now capped).

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#29 Posted : Monday, 19 September 2016 8:31:27 PM(UTC)
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I do like the comment about the steering wheel & relationship to the column shift. Being that an '84 WB Sedan was using VK commodore interior colours, it would make sense to use a Commodore steering wheel in the same colour, rather than a commercial wheel. Normally the WB sedan would have the single-spoke wheel, shared with the SL/E or Calais at the time, just with a different horn pad & badge.

But I think the comments above about the 2-spoke wheel from the low/mid level Commodore are quite valid - the flex on the single spoke is quote pronounced around the top third of the wheel (say from 10-2) in a forward-back direction, but less so in a rotation direction. Knowing that both those wheels place the rim the same distance from the driver, it rules out the wheel rim being too close, or too far away from the shift lever. So flex when using the wheel to brace the hand when moving the column shift lever could well be one point considered.

The other aspect could be safety for the lowest common denominator - there could be temptation to put your hand through the steering wheel and on to the column shift, rather than around the wheel. The 2 spoke wheel doesn't leave enough vacant real estate to really do this without being a bit of a contortionist, so perhaps that was also the thinking as well.

Perhaps there was also the thought of offering a very basic WB sedan as well? 6-seat, column shift, and no power steering maybe? The single spoke wheel is only allowed to be used on cars with power steering (quote obvious from the flexing issue) so the 2-spoke, also used on non-power steered commodores, would be the natural choice for that too. It may not have ever gone into production in basic form with no power steering, but the spec level for a column auto could have been built up from there.

What were the last of the WB Commercials using for a steering wheel? Were they all the 3-spoke sports style wheel? Or a Commodore 2-spoke wheel?
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Lingus Offline
#30 Posted : Monday, 19 September 2016 9:41:27 PM(UTC)
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With regard to standard issue steering wheels, I'm pretty sure that the WB commercial range followed the HZ series, with an ugly black item on all except for Kingswood utes ... Commodore bucket seats found their way into WB Kingswoods, but not the Commodore steering wheels.

If I've figured out the "insert image" function correctly for this forum, posted below is an image of a WB Kingswood prototype sedan, based as it was on the old HZ Statesman body ... you'll find this car on permanent display at the National Motor Museum at Birdwood, just outside of Adelaide. It has the venerable ol' 3300 blue motor under the bonnet and a blue/white tweed cloth interior.



Jet Offline
#31 Posted : Monday, 19 September 2016 10:10:43 PM(UTC)
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Late wb commercials had older hz wheel but in new colours
Also had sports option gts type in same colours, seen this in odd statesman too, maybe single spoke wheel just for caprice.
Several items saved for it as it was a fair bit more expensive
ExportHolden Offline
#32 Posted : Monday, 19 September 2016 10:43:15 PM(UTC)
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The WB six-seater was available from late '82 (I think, I don't have the exect info with me) but def before SII came out. So I don't think it was just about steering wheel colour.

I agree with the idea that it was about safety to not use the single-spoke wheel.

The boomerang-shape wheel in the commercials would have been a no-brainer, so why didn't GM-H use it? Only thing I can think of was that the commercial wheel was a bit too low rent to be on a luxury car.

I reckon the VH/VK wheel looks pretty odd myself (it's actually a VH wheel with the full lion badge). But it's certainly a talking point, and I'll be keeping it for originality's sake. The rim is actually pretty stuffed, crumbing and loose so I have a NOS green VK wheel that I'm going to put in ( after painting it the right colour)

Jet Offline
#33 Posted : Tuesday, 20 September 2016 12:01:00 AM(UTC)
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How or who can repaint steering wheel?
No one seem to have had much sucess
wbute Offline
#34 Posted : Tuesday, 20 September 2016 6:59:19 AM(UTC)
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They were not Commodore bucket seats in WB commercial. They were similar looking but only had vinyl trim and had different tracks.
As mentioned the steering wheels were still HQ-HZ style but we're matching colours to the trim.
I still vote that it was to prevent putting your arm through the steering wheel to shift speeds (twin spoke wheel).
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#35 Posted : Tuesday, 20 September 2016 7:36:40 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: Lingus Go to Quoted Post

With regard to standard issue steering wheels, I'm pretty sure that the WB commercial range followed the HZ series, with an ugly black item on all except for Kingswood utes ... Commodore bucket seats found their way into WB Kingswoods, but not the Commodore steering wheels.

If I've figured out the "insert image" function correctly for this forum, posted below is an image of a WB Kingswood prototype sedan, based as it was on the old HZ Statesman body ... you'll find this car on permanent display at the National Motor Museum at Birdwood, just outside of Adelaide. It has the venerable ol' 3300 blue motor under the bonnet and a blue/white tweed cloth interior.





AFAIK that isn't a WB Kingswood sedan. It is the prototype WA Kingswood sedan. Have you seen under the bonnet? I tried last time I was there but the curator was offsite. Would like to see what ID is on it. I'm pretty sure it would be a HJ body not a HZ. Note that this vehicle is essentially what came here (but in HQ guise) as GMH's new HQ Holden sedan when they were sent here by GM to replace GMH's proposed HQ (which was a heavily facelifted HK/HT). GMH designed their own sedan based upon the SWB coupe and made the sedan into the Statesman. From what I understand the HQ was supposed to be replaced with the HV around late 1972 and the WA replace the HV in 1974. I always thought that car was the WA sedan design from around 1971-2.

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Jet Offline
#36 Posted : Tuesday, 20 September 2016 8:37:30 AM(UTC)
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Yep, looks like the prototype WB sedan, has WB front end, mirrors.
Means it has to be around 1980

WB sedan was dropped as the Commodore was developed from EU opel - punters wanted smaller cars
HK1837 Offline
#37 Posted : Tuesday, 20 September 2016 8:53:41 AM(UTC)
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There was never a WB passenger line. WB grew out of the cancelled WA series, it simply used WA front styling.
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Lingus Offline
#38 Posted : Thursday, 22 September 2016 12:19:03 AM(UTC)
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The white car pictured above is definitely a survivor prototype WB Kingswood sedan ... pictured below - although not very clearly - is a prototype WB Premier sedan ... check out the rear bumper number plate graphics.






The WA series was a very different concept animal, smaller in overall size, featuring a large angular glasshouse and a sloping front nose piece reminiscent of the Chevrolet Monza ... it didn't progress beyond various full-size static clay proposals.

Edited by user Thursday, 22 September 2016 12:27:50 AM(UTC)  | Reason: attached image didn't load.

ExportHolden Offline
#39 Posted : Tuesday, 18 October 2016 2:20:17 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: wbute Go to Quoted Post
It's not Oyster is it?



Yep, Oyster it is. Finally dug out the WB parts manual and that's what 63T is.

Also saw a WB Series II Statesman brochure on eBay where the seller kindly took good pics of each page and the bench is listed as an option, but available with Oyster interior only. Explains why the 2 other bench-seat WB Statos I've seen on the web were also Oyster.

Wondering why there was never a WB commercials Series II. Probably they were selling well enough that Holden didn't need to spruce them up with a SII version.
Jet Offline
#40 Posted : Tuesday, 18 October 2016 3:49:33 PM(UTC)
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Commercials ran fair bit of older components like dash etc so didn't follow statesman too closely
We ut s didn't sell that well, there was dealer stock long time after last production
At the time they were quite expensive
I have oyster wb Kingswood ute
Its unavailable anymore but there are a couple of similar colours available
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