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abi Offline
#1 Posted : Wednesday, 28 November 2018 11:08:34 AM(UTC)
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My 327 GTS was converted to an internally regulated higher amperage alternator some years before I purchased it and I would like to change it back so it is visually closer to standard. Is there a way to make up an alternator using readily available parts? I have a 3 inch pulley somewhere in the shed which I purchased back in the 90's and also have a 35A Bosch alternator as fitted to HK - HG 6 and Holden V8. Looking at the HK parts book the Pulley, fan and most of the rear of the alternator are different in some way the regular Bosch alternator.

Any ideas or thoughts on making something up?
Dr Terry Offline
#2 Posted : Wednesday, 28 November 2018 11:20:24 AM(UTC)
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AFAIK the alternator fitted to both Type 1 & Type 2 327s are just a standard HK alternator with a larger pulley fitted.

Dr Terry

Edited by user Wednesday, 28 November 2018 2:26:36 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

If at first you don't succeed, just call it Version 1.0
abi Offline
#3 Posted : Wednesday, 28 November 2018 3:43:27 PM(UTC)
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Thanks for your reply Terry,I thought the same for years until I looked at the HK parts book (blue one)and noticed quite a few parts are different, fan, pulley, and a fair prportion of the rear of the alternator as well as the plastic mesh grille at the back.

I will come back with more details later when I have the book in front of me.

Adrian
HK1837 Offline
#4 Posted : Wednesday, 28 November 2018 3:51:40 PM(UTC)
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Look at the yellow book, not the blue book. Blue book is wrong in lots of places. Except I just checked and realised the yellow book doesn't have the Canadian engines in it! You really want the amendment issued at that time.

Edited by user Wednesday, 28 November 2018 4:10:35 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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abi Offline
#5 Posted : Wednesday, 28 November 2018 4:47:23 PM(UTC)
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OK, I,ve got the book in front of me. Blue HK parts catalog dated April 72.

161, 186 and 307 share the same Alternator P/N 2819151 (Bosch) This is a complete unit in including fan and pulley.

1st Type 327 uses same fan as above but uses 3 in pulley 2806231 (from memory this pulley is dished on the front face compared to 2nd Type 327 which is flatter profiled on the front face)

2nd Type 327 uses different fan 2808199 compared to all others which is 7430410. 'Plate Drive End' is different, this is the alloy casting with the pivot through-bolt on one side and the pinch bolt for belt tension adjustment on the other, its PN VS11003 compared to VS10539 for all others. 'Cover slip ring end', this is I think the plastic grille at the rear of the alternator, it is PN VS11004 compared to VS10544 for all others.

Well that's it, the fan, pulley and 'front plate' or main attachment housing are different as well as the rear cover (perhaps this is only colour, white instead of the usual black plastic cover of all others?). The other parts I thought were different are actually mounting hardware and bracketry which makes sense due to the different mounting method used.

So why would the fan and main alternator body be different and do you think I could modify a standard fan and alternator housing to suit? What is different about the rear cover or grille? Only colour or is the molding different?

Any help appreciated
Adrian


HK1837 Offline
#6 Posted : Wednesday, 28 November 2018 4:58:39 PM(UTC)
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Looks like the Canadian 327 uses the same alternator as a HT350. Fan is the same part number 2808199. Plate Drive End is the same. Cover is the same. Pulley for 350 is 2808198.

This assumes that the blue parts book is right, it may well just be listing the HT-G alternator for the HK, check the HK parts catalogue amendment before committing.
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abi Offline
#7 Posted : Wednesday, 28 November 2018 5:56:27 PM(UTC)
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The K parts catalog amendment I do not have.

I wonder if the changes to the 69 327 and ht 350 alternator are to move the vee belt centreline rearwards more in relation to the alternator, to package the alternator in front of the drivers cylinder head yet still be able to pick up the fan belt. This might explain the change to the pulley, fan and front housing 'plate'?
HK1837 Offline
#8 Posted : Wednesday, 28 November 2018 6:05:05 PM(UTC)
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If you know Phil Bartolo and have 30min free ask him. He will probably know.
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HK1837 Offline
#9 Posted : Wednesday, 28 November 2018 7:33:36 PM(UTC)
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Wayne put some photos here, may help a bit

http://www.fastlane.com....-fan-shroud-7435372.aspx
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abi Offline
#10 Posted : Wednesday, 28 November 2018 9:17:14 PM(UTC)
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Thanks HK, those pics help a lot, will compare fans to that photo as well as the rear plastic grille.
abi Offline
#11 Posted : Wednesday, 28 November 2018 9:44:39 PM(UTC)
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Just looked on ebay at 10 or more used HK Bosch alternators and all had exactly the same fans as each other, looked back at Waynes fan and it is different. The stamping is different, pressed-in strengthening ribs on the individual fan blades are completely different.

I will mock up my 3 inch pulley with a standard alternator and fan and see whats what.

Cheers

Adrian
camaroTT400 Offline
#12 Posted : Wednesday, 28 November 2018 10:18:49 PM(UTC)
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Im pretty sure the fan itself should have 199 stamped on the back of it and the alternator belt adjusting bolt on the front housing is actually offset about 5mm if that makes sense. Will try to upload pictures
camaroTT400 Offline
#13 Posted : Wednesday, 28 November 2018 11:01:03 PM(UTC)
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HK1837 Offline
#14 Posted : Thursday, 29 November 2018 5:50:56 AM(UTC)
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I'll check my alternators on the weekend, never noticed the fan difference.
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HK1837 Offline
#15 Posted : Thursday, 29 November 2018 5:57:23 AM(UTC)
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Adrian

How close is the fan on this one?
https://www.ebay.com.au/...AAOSw8lpZN6el:rk:20:pf:0
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abi Offline
#16 Posted : Thursday, 29 November 2018 11:26:55 AM(UTC)
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HK, the fan on that HR alternator looks to be identical to the 69 327 and HT350 around the fan blade areas, notice the single straight stiffening rib on each blade compared to the twin 'JJ' shaped ones on the HK to HG fans. I dont have a HR parts book, wonder if it is the same P/N fan? We cant get a good look at the fan mounting hub area of the fan and pulley on the 3 inch alternators because the big pulley blocks the view, this is the area that could be different due to Holden trying to get the vee belt centreline as rearward on the alternator as possible.

TT400, that alternator shows lots of clues, the shallow dish of the later pulley, the different fan and the white rear cage or grille.

I'm thinking the white grille is the same molding as the regular black one and is used as a quick identifier on the assembly line during engine dress, anyone confirm?

Im wondering if the fan hub area is different, and we cant see it hidden behind the 3inch pulley?

Keen to know the difference between the front housings, do you mean the offset of the pinch bolt tapping and how it is eccentric to the casting boss in your photo or some other area?

I dont suppose that alternator is burning a hole in your pocket? Looks perfect, what did it come off?

Edited by user Thursday, 29 November 2018 11:31:56 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

HK1837 Offline
#17 Posted : Thursday, 29 November 2018 11:45:41 AM(UTC)
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Will check my HR book tonight, but being a 28xxxxx part number tells me it isn’t HR.

Edited by user Thursday, 29 November 2018 11:47:39 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

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camaroTT400 Offline
#18 Posted : Thursday, 29 November 2018 4:21:03 PM(UTC)
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Hi Abi i built this alternator because the previous owner of the car had the original alternator chromed. So i had new pulleys machined up and got some plastic grilles made in the correct colour. Im pretty sure the correct fan can be found on any v8 ktg alternator. Also the positive terminals must be swapped around because they come close to the rocker cover. I was going to build a few more because i had spare pulleys and plastic grilles made up just havent had a chance
HK1837 Offline
#19 Posted : Thursday, 29 November 2018 7:01:58 PM(UTC)
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The fan part number is unique to Canadian 327 and 350, but it may well look the same with some minor difference around the bigger pulley. HQ 350 lists the same fan so that is probably what to chase, those engines are far more common.
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 1 user thanked HK1837 for this useful post.
camaroTT400 on 29/11/2018(UTC)
Squeak327 Offline
#20 Posted : Saturday, 1 December 2018 9:06:37 PM(UTC)
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Time to open a can of worms maybe. These photos were taken at Monaro Nationals in Warwick. They are of HT and HG 81837 models

Single strengthening rib on each blade and is stamped '199'


The next three photos show double strengthening ribs per blade and are also stamped '199'














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