Welcome Guest! To enable all features please Login or Register.

Notification

Icon
Error

Login


Take the time to read our Privacy Policy.

Liquefaction Offline
#1 Posted : Sunday, 28 July 2019 6:57:04 PM(UTC)
Liquefaction

Rank: Member

Reputation:

Groups: Registered
Joined: 3/07/2019(UTC)
Posts: 65
New Zealand

Thanks: 4 times
A few questions for the red engine gurus out there

I tore down the 186S today and the crank is a 7431320, I’m pretty sure it’s a steel one

The block has G1330 , is that August 1970?

The head is 7437395 h6 0 and with an L at the rear of the head

Is this the correct head, being a low compression head is seems wrong but I’m thinking this is a 161 head

I have a 161 high compression head in the shed I can use, and an 186a engine there I could take the head off

What is the correct head for a 186S for an hk ?

The pistons have a number 2 stamped in to them, I guess that means 20 thou over

Cheers
HK1837 Offline
#2 Posted : Sunday, 28 July 2019 7:11:32 PM(UTC)
HK1837

Rank: Veteran

Reputation:

Groups: Moderator, Registered, Veteran
Joined: 1/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 13,075

Thanks: 1 times
Was thanked: 167 time(s) in 165 post(s)
Al 186S are forged crankshaft originally. The parting line will tell you if cast or forged.

G is July but something wrong with the rest of that cast date.

All 179, 186 and 202 other than XU1 have L heads. H and L are only relevant to the 173 and down engines.

I think 186S head is identical to 186 and 161L head, just the valves and springs slightly different.

2 not sure. 20 thou over normally would be 020 on them.
_______________________________________________________
If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords?
 1 user thanked HK1837 for this useful post.
Liquefaction on 28/07/2019(UTC)
Liquefaction Offline
#3 Posted : Sunday, 28 July 2019 8:33:03 PM(UTC)
Liquefaction

Rank: Member

Reputation:

Groups: Registered
Joined: 3/07/2019(UTC)
Posts: 65
New Zealand

Thanks: 4 times
Originally Posted by: HK1837 Go to Quoted Post
Al 186S are forged crankshaft originally. The parting line will tell you if cast or forged.

G is July but something wrong with the rest of that cast date.

All 179, 186 and 202 other than XU1 have L heads. H and L are only relevant to the 173 and down engines.

I think 186S head is identical to 186 and 161L head, just the valves and springs slightly different.

2 not sure. 20 thou over normally would be 020 on them.

Thanks Byron
Once again you are a big help

The cast date has “Holden” above it and it’s definitely G 1 30

One further question if I may

How many different heads did the 186 come with from hr to hg?
HK1837 Offline
#4 Posted : Sunday, 28 July 2019 8:44:53 PM(UTC)
HK1837

Rank: Veteran

Reputation:

Groups: Moderator, Registered, Veteran
Joined: 1/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 13,075

Thanks: 1 times
Was thanked: 167 time(s) in 165 post(s)
G130 is good. That is July 13 1970. G1330 isn’t.

Not sure on casting numbers but I think there is only 2 186 heads design wise, normal and A/C. 186S had I think different exhaust valves and maybe springs but the casting should be the same. Confirm first though, I’m going solely from memory.
_______________________________________________________
If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords?
HK1837 Offline
#5 Posted : Monday, 29 July 2019 6:37:54 AM(UTC)
HK1837

Rank: Veteran

Reputation:

Groups: Moderator, Registered, Veteran
Joined: 1/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 13,075

Thanks: 1 times
Was thanked: 167 time(s) in 165 post(s)
I just checked Ben and Warren's book and 7437395 is right for HK-HG 186 or 186S without A/C and it will also be right for 161L. Given the cast dates of the engine block of July 13 1970 and the head on August 6th 1970 they will most likely have been originally together on a HG 6cyl model, probably a GTS but could also be from most other 6cyl HG models.
_______________________________________________________
If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords?
BENNETT Offline
#6 Posted : Wednesday, 31 July 2019 11:08:42 PM(UTC)
BENNETT

Rank: Newbie

Reputation:

Groups: Registered
Joined: 27/07/2019(UTC)
Posts: 1
United States
Location: valley stream

Decent, need to accomplish something like this with mine.
Liquefaction Offline
#7 Posted : Tuesday, 6 August 2019 12:51:11 PM(UTC)
Liquefaction

Rank: Member

Reputation:

Groups: Registered
Joined: 3/07/2019(UTC)
Posts: 65
New Zealand

Thanks: 4 times
The block has 6 big x’s welded into the inside of the block
Also the springs are thicker than normal 186 springs
And the spring retainer caps all have x on them

These are the differences from a standard 186 I’ve seen so far

The head was a bit to slogged out so I’m putting a 161hc head on it
It will receive a stage 3 cam and the ww2 will get 253 jets
HK1837 Offline
#8 Posted : Tuesday, 6 August 2019 4:13:30 PM(UTC)
HK1837

Rank: Veteran

Reputation:

Groups: Moderator, Registered, Veteran
Joined: 1/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 13,075

Thanks: 1 times
Was thanked: 167 time(s) in 165 post(s)
It will be pretty high in compression with a 161H head on it. Will be around 10:1 static with flat top 186 pistons so may not like most fuel, unless you get the right cam for it.
_______________________________________________________
If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords?
Liquefaction Offline
#9 Posted : Tuesday, 6 August 2019 8:35:10 PM(UTC)
Liquefaction

Rank: Member

Reputation:

Groups: Registered
Joined: 3/07/2019(UTC)
Posts: 65
New Zealand

Thanks: 4 times
Originally Posted by: HK1837 Go to Quoted Post
It will be pretty high in compression with a 161H head on it. Will be around 10:1 static with flat top 186 pistons so may not like most fuel, unless you get the right cam for it.


It will be run on 100 octane pump gas

Is the cross webbing on the block a feature of the s engine?

HK1837 Offline
#10 Posted : Tuesday, 6 August 2019 9:35:31 PM(UTC)
HK1837

Rank: Veteran

Reputation:

Groups: Moderator, Registered, Veteran
Joined: 1/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 13,075

Thanks: 1 times
Was thanked: 167 time(s) in 165 post(s)
As far as I know there is no difference between 186L, 186P or 186S blocks. Basically when they were cast they were identical bar whatever minor variations there were between different pattern components used to form up each sand mould.
_______________________________________________________
If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords?
castellan Offline
#11 Posted : Thursday, 8 August 2019 11:17:56 AM(UTC)
castellan

Rank: Veteran

Reputation:

Groups: Registered
Joined: 26/02/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,341

Thanks: 12 times
Was thanked: 13 time(s) in 11 post(s)
Originally Posted by: Liquefaction Go to Quoted Post
The block has 6 big x’s welded into the inside of the block
Also the springs are thicker than normal 186 springs
And the spring retainer caps all have x on them

These are the differences from a standard 186 I’ve seen so far

The head was a bit to slogged out so I’m putting a 161hc head on it
It will receive a stage 3 cam and the ww2 will get 253 jets


They are not welded X they are cast as to the sand casting as a inspector does them markings as he is pointing something out with the sand casting starting to get out of wack, some have O cast in the same place. any block regardless can have such markings.
HK1837 Offline
#12 Posted : Thursday, 8 August 2019 11:25:41 AM(UTC)
HK1837

Rank: Veteran

Reputation:

Groups: Moderator, Registered, Veteran
Joined: 1/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 13,075

Thanks: 1 times
Was thanked: 167 time(s) in 165 post(s)
Some have B too as in “B cast” heads. I guess X was an easy thing to scratch into the green sand.
_______________________________________________________
If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords?
castellan Offline
#13 Posted : Thursday, 8 August 2019 4:37:15 PM(UTC)
castellan

Rank: Veteran

Reputation:

Groups: Registered
Joined: 26/02/2009(UTC)
Posts: 1,341

Thanks: 12 times
Was thanked: 13 time(s) in 11 post(s)
Originally Posted by: HK1837 Go to Quoted Post
Some have B too as in “B cast” heads. I guess X was an easy thing to scratch into the green sand.


No the B cast heads is on the outside for that reason to ID the heads.

I think that we do have what he is talking about with pictures like so on this forum somewhere.
HK1837 Offline
#14 Posted : Thursday, 8 August 2019 4:59:18 PM(UTC)
HK1837

Rank: Veteran

Reputation:

Groups: Moderator, Registered, Veteran
Joined: 1/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 13,075

Thanks: 1 times
Was thanked: 167 time(s) in 165 post(s)
Yes it is on the outside but it is there for a purpose. Like the X on early pollution V8 heads or across the 308 on L34 blocks. It was scratched into the green sand for whatever reason.
_______________________________________________________
If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords?
Liquefaction Offline
#15 Posted : Sunday, 18 August 2019 9:39:55 PM(UTC)
Liquefaction

Rank: Member

Reputation:

Groups: Registered
Joined: 3/07/2019(UTC)
Posts: 65
New Zealand

Thanks: 4 times
The engine is almost back together now

New rings and bearings
Bore hone
Stage 3 cam
Hc 161 head with some porting
Decked block
186s inlet
186s exh manifolds

I’m a bit concerned with the carb
The numbers show it’s a 253 hj ww carb

It’s been rebuilt but now I read that at idle these carbs aren’t suited to the 6

Should I be looking for a 186s carb or can I make this 253 carb work?
Thanks in advance
clay Offline
#16 Posted : Tuesday, 27 August 2019 11:38:38 PM(UTC)
clay

Rank: Newbie

Reputation:

Groups: Registered
Joined: 27/08/2019(UTC)
Posts: 2
Australia
Location: Willunga

Same carb, just different jets. The HJ carb will have carbon canister vent tube in the top of the float chamber facing forward, which can be removed and plugged. I have the sizes somewhere but they don’t really mean much unless you are running factory 186 through to the exhaust tip. See how it runs and maybe get a tune on the dyno. If you are running a stage three cam and hi comp head you are a long way off stock.
Cheers
Clay
HK1837 Offline
#17 Posted : Wednesday, 28 August 2019 6:55:27 AM(UTC)
HK1837

Rank: Veteran

Reputation:

Groups: Moderator, Registered, Veteran
Joined: 1/03/2005(UTC)
Posts: 13,075

Thanks: 1 times
Was thanked: 167 time(s) in 165 post(s)
Only 1/75 on HJ carbs have the canister port, any off cars complianced in the last half of 1974 use the same carb as a HQ (no cansiter). Be wary of if your carb is a manual or auto carb as the vacuum advance characteristics are different between them. If it is a 1/75 onwards HJ carb it should have both ported and full vacuum ports though (as the canister operates off a ported vacuum port) but earlier ones may only have the one port but connected to different vacuum sources. I'll send you a scan showing where the two ports are if you like.

As Clay says the factory jets don't mean much as you are far from a stock 186S spec engine.
_______________________________________________________
If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords?
Liquefaction Offline
#18 Posted : Wednesday, 28 August 2019 3:18:48 PM(UTC)
Liquefaction

Rank: Member

Reputation:

Groups: Registered
Joined: 3/07/2019(UTC)
Posts: 65
New Zealand

Thanks: 4 times
Originally Posted by: HK1837 Go to Quoted Post
Only 1/75 on HJ carbs have the canister port, any off cars complianced in the last half of 1974 use the same carb as a HQ (no cansiter). Be wary of if your carb is a manual or auto carb as the vacuum advance characteristics are different between them. If it is a 1/75 onwards HJ carb it should have both ported and full vacuum ports though (as the canister operates off a ported vacuum port) but earlier ones may only have the one port but connected to different vacuum sources. I'll send you a scan showing where the two ports are if you like.

As Clay says the factory jets don't mean much as you are far from a stock 186S spec engine.


Il get the numbers off the carb tomorrow, I’m just going to run in the cam with the standard single barrel stromberg as the ww is untested
Liquefaction Offline
#19 Posted : Thursday, 19 September 2019 6:57:09 PM(UTC)
Liquefaction

Rank: Member

Reputation:

Groups: Registered
Joined: 3/07/2019(UTC)
Posts: 65
New Zealand

Thanks: 4 times
I ended up shelving the ww2 and have gone with a lc xu1 triple carb set up

I bolted it up today and there is not much room between the last carb and the heater box
I’ve still got to rig up a linkage set up, hopefully it’s not too much of a drama

Anyone had this set up on a hk ht or hg ?
Users browsing this topic
Guest
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Powered by YAF | YAF © 2003-2019, Yet Another Forum.NET
This page was generated in 0.401 seconds.