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HK1837 Offline
#1 Posted : Wednesday, 6 April 2016 6:06:33 AM(UTC)
HK1837

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AMCS shows this as deposit taken, wasn't listed as such a few days ago.

Understandably it probably sold for an offer lower but would be interesting to find out how much for.

Are we seeing the emergence of the true Aussie Muscle Car pecking order in terms of value, where the HK GTS327 and HT GTS350M are essentially at the top or all but sharing it with the XY GT-HO?

https://www.australianmu...t-327-v8-dep-taken.html

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If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords?
gm5735 Offline
#2 Posted : Wednesday, 6 April 2016 11:01:04 AM(UTC)
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Hard to know what they are really worth without knowing just how good that particular car is. The ad says it's painted with 2 pack, which to me devalues the car.
I can't see the day the HKTG ever get to XY GTHO prices, purely from a rarity point of view.
In HKTG terms the HG350M would be the rarest, but the prices I've seen don't reflect it. (Arguably HG350A is rarer, but the prices don't reflect that either)
The Warwick Yellow HK327 still has a certain cachet that helps people open their wallets, even though the HK327 is by far the most common of the HKTG 81837 cars.
HK1837 Offline
#3 Posted : Wednesday, 6 April 2016 12:27:35 PM(UTC)
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They were the most common, but possibly not anymore. Unlike GT-HO where reportedly more than were made exist today! Or so people say.
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gm5735 Offline
#4 Posted : Wednesday, 6 April 2016 12:59:21 PM(UTC)
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Going on nothing more than my personal perceptions, and what I see in the Victorian Monaro Clubs and at various shows, and in advertisements, I believe the HK327s still surviving outnumber the HT350 and HG350 by a fair margin. It stands to reason since arguably twice as many were built.

I thought the identity of the XW and XY GTHO cars were pretty well known as Ford had better records from the period than did Holden.
What is fun is the fringe cars - the ones which don't say HO on the compliance plate but were built as:

1/ One off specials for the Queen,
2/ A secret Ford project
3/ Special racing version built but never documented as told to the owner by a friend of a friend's drinking buddy who used to work for Ford down the pub
4/ Converted from a Falcon 500 by the factory.

And any other excuse/rationalisation you can think of.

That's the beauty of BS in some peoples worlds - the longer and the louder you say it, the more it becomes the truth.
HK1837 Offline
#5 Posted : Wednesday, 6 April 2016 1:32:01 PM(UTC)
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Might be right. I'll ask Ben. I get the impression he has recorded a lot less HK's especially the earlier cars than HT. Not sure about HG. If I remember conversations correctly the bulk of surviving HK's are the blues and silvers - cars bought to be generally treasured rather than flogged to death like it appears most red and yellow ones were, yet we know the build numbers were far higher in red and yellow. I know we've talked about apparent survival rates of collectable GMH stuff (in reference to ball-parking Sandman numbers) and it sits around 2x% for most of them. I think this is where the comments about XY GT-HO numbers come from - there are far too many left today to be all originally a GT-HO (other than the numbers on them).
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we wreck 81837s only Offline
#6 Posted : Wednesday, 6 April 2016 5:33:27 PM(UTC)
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rumoured sale price is $200k, reliable source
HK1837 Offline
#7 Posted : Wednesday, 6 April 2016 6:41:59 PM(UTC)
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Still good return though, and I have been told it is a nice car but not concours.
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detective Offline
#8 Posted : Wednesday, 6 April 2016 7:09:43 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: HK1837 Go to Quoted Post
Might be right. I'll ask Ben. I get the impression he has recorded a lot less HK's especially the earlier cars than HT. Not sure about HG. If I remember conversations correctly the bulk of surviving HK's are the blues and silvers - cars bought to be generally treasured rather than flogged to death like it appears most red and yellow ones were, yet we know the build numbers were far higher in red and yellow. I know we've talked about apparent survival rates of collectable GMH stuff (in reference to ball-parking Sandman numbers) and it sits around 2x% for most of them. I think this is where the comments about XY GT-HO numbers come from - there are far too many left today to be all originally a GT-HO (other than the numbers on them).



...just on the note of the Red and Yellow ones being more predominant then, but rarer now.....possibly the outcome of the many of these coloured 327's stolen on their WOW appeal ??

HK1837 Offline
#9 Posted : Wednesday, 6 April 2016 7:30:21 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: detective Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: HK1837 Go to Quoted Post
Might be right. I'll ask Ben. I get the impression he has recorded a lot less HK's especially the earlier cars than HT. Not sure about HG. If I remember conversations correctly the bulk of surviving HK's are the blues and silvers - cars bought to be generally treasured rather than flogged to death like it appears most red and yellow ones were, yet we know the build numbers were far higher in red and yellow. I know we've talked about apparent survival rates of collectable GMH stuff (in reference to ball-parking Sandman numbers) and it sits around 2x% for most of them. I think this is where the comments about XY GT-HO numbers come from - there are far too many left today to be all originally a GT-HO (other than the numbers on them).



...just on the note of the Red and Yellow ones being more predominant then, but rarer now.....possibly the outcome of the many of these coloured 327's stolen on their WOW appeal ??



Maybe, but just think about the hero colours in other later series, like Hothouse and Tiger - they were everywhere once but not around anymore despite the cars still being common today.

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HGV8 Offline
#10 Posted : Wednesday, 6 April 2016 7:34:19 PM(UTC)
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It doesn't look over restored which I like.
Shame about the 2 pac.
Shows some signs of use after restoration.

Surprised it sold for around "$200,000". Seen as nice for almost half that over the last couple years. Maybe their on the boil again.

It seems to be the HK GTS command higher prices then the HT/G GTS.

Funnily enough all through the 1970's 80's 90's early 2000's HK 81837's were cheaper then manual HT/G 81837's.
Bit of a turn around in the last 10 years or so.

How would it go with the petrol spill guard and 2 pac paint in a concours?

Jim

Edited by user Saturday, 9 April 2016 11:07:02 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

j.williams
Warwick Yellow Offline
#11 Posted : Thursday, 7 April 2016 12:56:38 PM(UTC)
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The car has been sold and the price was $220,000.00
I believe this was a well known earlier restoration owned by an older guy "Brian" back from the early 2000's, maybe late 1990's.
Car has books and is technically very, very good but not concourse in finish.

I think part of the high price is the restoration being with NOS and not rare spares items.

Beats the Red HK sold to NZ recently for 190K.

Warwick Yellow Offline
#12 Posted : Thursday, 7 April 2016 1:31:38 PM(UTC)
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Now I remember - Brian Mclellan - I think it was his ex car. The car placed in Concourse at Wangaratta behind Randy Durdin 1st- Gold 327 and Darren Atkins, Warwick Yellow 327.
HK1837 Offline
#13 Posted : Thursday, 7 April 2016 1:50:22 PM(UTC)
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I asked Ben, he has about 20-25% recorded of each of HK-HG GTS327/350 produced from each assembly plant. Some are lower, some higher than others. This is recording over 30 years, but also includes a sample of ID plates only and ID plates on different bodies amongst real cars however this may simply offset the few cars yet to surface. So we are realistically talking like 200-250 HK GTS327, 175 max HT GTS350 and maybe 100 HG GTS350 left. Not many. I bet the "on paper" existing XT GT-HO % numbers aren't that low, but in reality they should be.
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gm5735 Offline
#14 Posted : Thursday, 7 April 2016 6:32:15 PM(UTC)
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Thanks Byron. That makes sense, and reflects what I've seen. I believe the HK327 number manufactured is fairly accurately known as it was reported by GMH to the ABS, and is a bit over 1400 cars. Best guesses seem to be HT350, around 700 cars and HG350 around 500.

Did you mean to say XT GT-HO? I assume not. It seems to be thought about 100 authenticated XY GTHO cars still exist, out of, I believe, 300 built. Hopefully a few Ford fans can correct my errors here.

Not surprisingly, some of the owners are secretive, and the cars rarely if ever see the light of day, so it might be a little more difficult to judge.

Edited by user Thursday, 7 April 2016 6:34:54 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

HK1837 Offline
#15 Posted : Thursday, 7 April 2016 7:06:35 PM(UTC)
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I meant XY, typo.

1192 HK GTS327. Approx 750 HT GTS350 (including a number of exports). Just over 400 HG GTS350.
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we wreck 81837s only Offline
#16 Posted : Friday, 8 April 2016 8:58:59 PM(UTC)
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regardless, a lot of money to hand over, and 10 of the best CONCOURS!!!! not CONCOURSE Warwick yellow 327 cars still don't come near 1 track red HO :)
castellan Offline
#17 Posted : Saturday, 9 April 2016 1:03:53 PM(UTC)
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A mate has a HK Monaro that was a 161 low compression 3 on the tree, that just happened to evolve into a 307 GTS over night.
Silverfox Offline
#18 Posted : Thursday, 21 April 2016 11:11:06 PM(UTC)
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Hi Guys.

I agree with most of this. I do believe good HKTG 327/350 Monaros are very scarce. I know from my own efforts in finding both HK327s and XYGTHOs out there that it was easier to find Phase threes. I had three Phase threes offered to me. All of them were bonafide albeit each with their own issues which weren't deal breakers. Regarding the search for Monaros it was much more difficult to find good accurate examples. I did bid on the Warwick Yellow 327 at the Sydney Motor Show Auction which set a record. Although one of the final bidders, I did not go home with it.

It has been nearly a decade since we have seen these sale dollar values.
I believe Monaros did not get their day in the sun like GT Falcons have. Interestingly , the A9-X Torana seems to have overtaken the homologation-special Monaros regards prices. I like the Toranas but in terms of being pure homologation road going race cars they are not in the same league. A standard HK327 was quicker in a straight line than the road going Torana which was the result of the Muscle car scare of 1972 and Aust design rule 27-A (pollution). After Evan Green's "160 MPH Supercars soon" headline CAMS changed the rules allowing many modifications to the racecars thus negating the need for big horsepower engines in the road cars.....so the HKTG really were more of a roadgoing racecar.

At any time there are only a handful of top end HKTGs on the market so it is about time.

Edited by user Saturday, 6 August 2016 8:27:32 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

"HOLDEN MONARO. OUT TO DRIVE YOU WILD!"
Silverfox Offline
#19 Posted : Thursday, 21 April 2016 11:14:02 PM(UTC)
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Edited by user Saturday, 6 August 2016 8:30:15 PM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

"HOLDEN MONARO. OUT TO DRIVE YOU WILD!"
wbute Offline
#20 Posted : Friday, 22 April 2016 5:57:31 AM(UTC)
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The Toranas probably will go around the Monaro in price mainly because less and less people have seen them race. Really the age group that has even seen them ever driven on the road must be thinning out. That's the sad part about collectors never driving them. Not only are the cars coming up for sale less, the number of buyers surely must start to shrink due to age as well?
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