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Monaro magic book - Norm Darwin
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Warren Turnbull Offline
#21 Posted : Sunday, 14 February 2010 6:07:48 AM(UTC)
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I shall have to check what corrections I made, as the pages you mentioned I sent back to Norm with highlighter.

Finally, it is not my work, I wrote the forward and made suggestions to Norm and made some corrections, sent some information. I would suggest that you take some of your concerns to the person who wrote, edited and published it.

Warren

Edited by user Sunday, 14 February 2010 6:13:02 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified
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Warren Turnbull Offline
#22 Posted : Sunday, 14 February 2010 9:33:41 AM(UTC)
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Have gone over my files and cannot say what I did or did not manage to proof reade correctly.

I do remmemebr scrubbing the hG part in the HQ, did add some stuff to the chart with the numbering eror and it was always there, so yes did not pick that one.

May have missed the LS thing, was a long time ago.

I have no doubt done Norm and others a major disservise with the reading of the book and making suggestions.

As far as a quiz as to my mistakes, my crime here is not checking every little dot and T. Next time I shall take your advise and give the job to someone else. Maybe yourself next time.

No doubt Norm is going to run out of book from this print, so DA, how about you collect all the errors and send to Norm, so the next issue is better.

Warren
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hazzard county Offline
#23 Posted : Sunday, 14 February 2010 9:55:21 AM(UTC)
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hey barnes send the book back if you dont like it. im sure norm will liquid paper out the mistakes for you.just like holdens did with all the recalls back in the day
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adam PERTH Offline
#24 Posted : Sunday, 14 February 2010 10:49:18 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by D. A. Barnes
[brWarren



It is the option codes that I object to, not the prices. Who said anything about the prices? L33? WTF. M21 is not an L6 transmission. M22 does not go with a 308.I[/quote]

L33 is the low comp 253. afaik.

WANTED:
-2 14 x 9.25 CSA style Centrelines.
-2 x 15 x 8 Dragway centrelines
Old holdens brought on the spot, quick decision, cash paid.
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Dr Terry Offline
#25 Posted : Sunday, 14 February 2010 5:37:28 PM(UTC)
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I think D.A. is being a tad harsh.

As Warren has said, much of Norms data is straight out of GM-H parts manuals etc. & as such is generic HQ, not necessarily coupe specific. On pages 100 & 101, he doesnt actually state that coupes were built in Adelaide or Brisbane, he just shows body plates from those plants. The Adelaide & Brisbane body plates shown actually depict SS & Monaro GTS sedans, not coupes.

I dont quite get your point about the HQ speedos. Unless you go into a plant by plant VIN list & mention that there are imperial only, dual scale & metric only speedos, I think as a quick summary his March 73 statement is OK. How would you summarise the introduction of metric speedos into HQ production ?

Page 97: I cant explain the number of errors in the options list. My guess is that it was totally missed at the proof reading stage. Options UD1 & N60 do exist & I dont get your point about JL2.

I will agree that some of the diff ratios on page 98 are incorrect, there are also some very odd typos, but after having written a book or two myself, I can tell you that its only too easy for these errors to appear & then even easier to be missed in proof reading.

Pace 99 is more of a layout problem, rather than being factually wrong. The charts themselves are almost a straight lift of GM-H data.

I think Norms new book is a great read & has shown the whole Monaro & GM-H history in another light. I think that the amount of new, previously unpublished information far outweighs the errors in his technical data.

I know that there are errors in my own recent book, but I can sleep at night knowing that 99.9% of people will not realise that they exist & that most readers are very happy with the book as a whole. Besides, picking them up now makes the second print run an even better book.

Dr Terry


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There are 3 types of people in the world.
1. Those who can count.
2. Those who cant.
If at first you don't succeed, just call it Version 1.0
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jim Offline
#26 Posted : Sunday, 14 February 2010 5:56:43 PM(UTC)
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Sounds to me like 1 Billion things right and a few things wrong.....I wish we were all that accurate!.....NICE WORK NORM>

Jim in Adelaide...Hindsight is bad vision!
Jim in Adelaide..
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Satans HQ Offline
#27 Posted : Sunday, 14 February 2010 9:17:14 PM(UTC)
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Will be buying this book this week, looking forward to reading it, spelling mistakes or not.
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commodorenut Offline
#28 Posted : Sunday, 14 February 2010 11:37:14 PM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by jim
Sounds to me like 1 Billion things right and a few things wrong.....I wish we were all that accurate!.....NICE WORK NORM>

Exactly!

Were all human.

If you look at a production facility, they allow for a human error rate of a certain percentage.

This book is probably 99.997% accurate.

I dont know much about pre-commodore stuff, but when I have a question about them, I ask Warren or Terry. Neither of these guys is going to sit down & give me a 3 hour history of the Monaro, nor would I expect them to spend the time, or have that knowledge off the top of their head.

I reckon this book is going to be a pretty good read for me, and for anyone who is not in the top 0.5% of informed "experts" about these cars.

So what if it has a few errors in the production options list - the vast majority of people who will read this book probably wont even do more than a cursory skim over the options list.

If youre really that hung up on accuracy, or restoring a car to the enth degree, then you wouldnt put all your eggs in one basket now would you? You would research from a variety of sources, and youd qualify that reasearch, before deciding on your own fact.

Good on Norm for producing the book. Lets see anyone whinging about it, grow the kahunas to have a go at publishing a book, and do something as good as what Norm has done.

Only Ben, Warren & Terry have done so, and none of these guys are complaining are they?




Cheers,

Mick
_______________________________________________________________

Judge a successful man not on how he treats his peers, but on how he treats those less fortunate.
Cheers,

Mick
_______________________________________________________________

Judge a successful man not on how he treats his peers, but on how he treats those less fortunate.
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commodorenut Offline
#29 Posted : Sunday, 14 February 2010 11:38:38 PM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by D. A. Barnes
I want positive proof that I have a car worthy of what I want Shannons to insure it for. What about yourself?


So its all about the money & not the passion now?

Cheers,

Mick
_______________________________________________________________

Judge a successful man not on how he treats his peers, but on how he treats those less fortunate.
Cheers,

Mick
_______________________________________________________________

Judge a successful man not on how he treats his peers, but on how he treats those less fortunate.
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HJHeaven Offline
#30 Posted : Monday, 15 February 2010 9:53:16 PM(UTC)
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To be honest, i find some of the commentary a little interesting.

Lets see if i have this right....

1. Norm has just released his book and already the critics are out and whinging about a few details which may be erroneous (not that i would know by a long stretch).

2. I understand that when Ben and Warren released their book some time ago it also had some errors in it (which have been pointed out) AND it appears to me (through the recent thread about the Monaro Story book) that part of the reason that book wont be re-printed is because of the errors and because of the response from the punters.

3. So, i wouldnt surprise me too much if history repeated and Norm considers that the exercise wasnt worth the grief and the book is only presented in one edition (due to the criticism received for foing what few people do) AND THEN, the book increases in price on the after market due to the limited run and starts to call big money

4. Ironically, the persons who were first to criticise then get all sh*tty when someone suggests a reprint due to their interest and threatens legal action (or has a dummy spit) if a reprint occurs - because the book they bagged originally becomes valuable. Hardly fair on the bloke who wrote it.

IMO, this is all a little precious - isnt it?. I for one really do appreciate the fact that some people put their nuts on the line and make the investment in time and money to put this stuff together. If it wasnt for them, i would have great difficulty learning more about my chosen hobby.

Good on you Norm, i really do appreciate the effort you went to. It is a great read.

I am not allowed a mistress so i got a GTS - and its better
A GTS/4 is a monaro - so nuuur
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80569K Offline
#31 Posted : Monday, 15 February 2010 10:42:00 PM(UTC)
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Excellent reading of the situation, well put HJ.
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HZute-efi-VS5L Offline
#32 Posted : Tuesday, 16 February 2010 6:49:46 AM(UTC)
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agreed well said.
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www.stickthisdecals.com.au
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D. A. Barnes Offline
#33 Posted : Saturday, 27 February 2010 2:31:20 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by commodorenut
quote:
Originally posted by D. A. Barnes
I want positive proof that I have a car worthy of what I want Shannons to insure it for. What about yourself?


So its all about the money & not the passion now?

Cheers,

Mick
_______________________________________________________________

Judge a successful man not on how he treats his peers, but on how he treats those less fortunate.


Im sorry you misread my words. I am not selling my car. I would like to see it is insured appropriately in the current marketplace. Like anything of value, there is a scale of worth attached to it. Good ones always cost more to insure. If Shannons were to use the latest Monaro book as a reference source then there would be issues with a number of cars insured with them. And by the way it is always about the passion.
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D. A. Barnes Offline
#34 Posted : Saturday, 27 February 2010 2:46:12 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr Terry
I think D.A. is being a tad harsh.

I dont quite get your point about the HQ speedos. Unless you go into a plant by plant VIN list & mention that there are imperial only, dual scale & metric only speedos, I think as a quick summary his March 73 statement is OK. How would you summarise the introduction of metric speedos into HQ production ?

Dr Terry


_______________________________________
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1. Those who can count.
2. Those who cant.


Thank you for supporting me here. I see that by the lack of activity in regard to Monaro Magic of late that readers have realised I was on the money with my comments.

HQ speedos in 1973. Here is what I know as fact. From 2/73 some cars were fitted with dual scale (220km/h-140MPH) instruments. By mid 1973 a resonable proportion of cars had them. The bulletin detailing the new speedometers came out around September that year and tells of when all cars would have them fitted in production. I have yet to see an original 350 car with a speedo other than 140MPH in it from pre October 1973. This subject would be good for one of your quizzes. The point in Monaro Magic is just wrong in relation to the speedos in HQ Monaros in 1973. I know guys with a lot more knowledge than I have on this and they would be able to show up the Monaro Magic comment even better. Looking at HQ cars will reveal a lot.
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anonymous Offline
#35 Posted : Saturday, 27 February 2010 6:40:28 AM(UTC)
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gmholdman Offline
#36 Posted : Saturday, 27 February 2010 8:41:12 AM(UTC)
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Australia

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Any interest????? Have Norm Darwins book "100 years of GM in Australia" the book has 364 pages of history and covers all models up to HSV VX. This book has not had the pages opened and as I have 2 this one is for sale at $55.00 plus postage. AL.
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HTGTS1969 Offline
#37 Posted : Saturday, 27 February 2010 10:24:38 PM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by D. A. Barnes


quote:


Thank you for supporting me here. I see that by the lack of activity in regard to Monaro Magic of late that readers have realised I was on the money with my comments.



Or perhaps everyone has just moved on to something more interesting.
Monaro - Move ahead of your time
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Satans HQ Offline
#38 Posted : Sunday, 28 February 2010 7:19:43 AM(UTC)
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I got my copy the other day and am in the midst of reading it, fascinating read, well worth the money in my opinion.
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65ehpv Offline
#39 Posted : Thursday, 4 March 2010 11:08:10 PM(UTC)
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Flicked thru the book last night. My interest is in the HG. Was dissapointed to see that the heading at the top of all the pages in the HG section were the letters HT

As you can either ay 100 bux for the leather bound book or 55 bux for the hard copy, i would have expected better editing and review before going to print.

Carpe Diem
Carpe Diem
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mackv8 Offline
#40 Posted : Thursday, 4 March 2010 11:49:57 PM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by gmholdman
Any interest????? Have Norm Darwins book "100 years of GM in Australia" the book has 364 pages of history and covers all models up to HSV VX. This book has not had the pages opened and as I have 2 this one is for sale at $55.00 plus postage. AL.


I am interested in this book.
Where abouts are you in melbourne.

looking for an ex ambulance based on the hj/x/z 2 tonner see photo

and collector of all things ambulance police fire and the odd hq to wb parts
looking for an ex ambulance based on the hj/x/z 2 tonner see photo

and collector of all things ambulance police fire and the odd hq to wb parts
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