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MONARO NATIONALS GOSSIP.
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dirty davo Offline
#41 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 7:07:26 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by Warren Turnbull
The carpet and scuff plates are legitamate options on the car, ust like the 186, 4 speed, floor shift etc. pauls is also optioned.

The judging of concours is very difficult, and although the Paul Kelly car is very good, Nick's car was beter. Options has nothing to do with it, infact options can get you in more trouble as there are more things to get right.

Paul knows why he did not win, he maybe able to fix this one day and then will beat Nick. The fact is also that the car is great, and recieves a lot of recognition.

Warren
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dirty davo Offline
#42 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 8:14:29 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by Warren Turnbull
The carpet and scuff plates are legitamate options on the car, ust like the 186, 4 speed, floor shift etc. pauls is also optioned.

The judging of concours is very difficult, and although the Paul Kelly car is very good, Nick's car was beter. Options has nothing to do with it, infact options can get you in more trouble as there are more things to get right.

Paul knows why he did not win, he maybe able to fix this one day and then will beat Nick. The fact is also that the car is great, and recieves a lot of recognition.

Warren
OK, WARREN, LETS CLEAR THIS UP?
I agree that nicks hk is exceptional
BUT,
how can a HK have "HT antique gold carpet" when it should have been buckskin beige??????????????
SURELY EVEN YOU KNOW THAT EVERY HK ONLY EVER HAD BUCKSKIN COLOURED TRIM. INCLUDING CARPET? (antique gold wasnt even invented, when hk was out there, dont you agree??????????
HT INTRODUCED ANTIQUE GOLD,,NOT HK? is this correct????????????
please correct me if im wrong
therefore shouldnt it have been classed as "a modification"???
let alone th black console,chrome scuff plates etc etc
now look at that fuse box!!!!!!
any under 40thousand mile car shouldnt have even had a fuse touched! let alone rubbed & rubbed a hundred times to have worn more than half th writing away like that one has??????
maan that car musta had some major electrical issues to be worn like that one!!!!!!!!!!!
even my crusty rusty ole million mile ute fuse box is less worn than that!!!!!!!!
maybe some brown nosing/favouritism may have been contributed?
cant beleive some things so obvious were overlooked by a "guru like yaself?
regards dirty davo.
shoot me down (by all means if im wrong)
after all, ive only wrecked hundreds of these over last 20+ years
i await your reply
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Warren Turnbull Offline
#43 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 8:50:40 AM(UTC)
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how can a HK have "HT antique gold carpet" when it should have been buckskin beige??????????????
SURELY EVEN YOU KNOW THAT EVERY HK ONLY EVER HAD BUCKSKIN COLOURED TRIM. INCLUDING CARPET? (antique gold wasnt even invented, when hk was out there, dont you agree??????????
HT INTRODUCED ANTIQUE GOLD,,NOT HK? is this correct????????????
please correct me if im wrong therefore shouldnt it have been classed as "a modification"???

This is a very good point, if the carpet is incorrct as you say and it is HT, then under your ruling the car should be classed as modified, then Paul's car would also have to be disqualified.
let alone th black console,chrome scuff plates etc etc

All Sydney cars had Black consoles, irrespective of trim colour. See the road test between the 186S GTS, Pacer, capri and I cannot remember the other car, blue trim black console, as Sydney built car.

Chrome scuff plates is part of Interior finish package.
now look at that fuse box!!!!!!
any under 40thousand mile car shouldnt have even had a fuse touched! let alone rubbed & rubbed a hundred times to have worn more than half th writing away like that one has??????
maan that car musta had some major electrical issues to be worn like that one!!!!!!!!!!! even my crusty rusty ole million mile ute fuse box is less worn than that!!!!!!!!

Cannot comment on that one, but someone may have put a cleaning fluid on it at some stage, who knows.
maybe some brown nosing/favouritism may have been contributed?

I do not understand this, I know Nick and Paul, but would not consider it in any judging. I was not completely involved in the concours judging, I missed part of it due to other judging commitments, but do know both cars reasonably well, to say that Nick's was better on the day, as it was discussed why he won.

To discuss these without the owner's permission would be inappropriate.
cant beleive some things so obvious were overlooked by a "guru like yaself?
regards dirty davo.
shoot me down (by all means if im wrong)
after all, ive only wrecked hundreds of these over last 20+ years i await your reply

I should remind you that I am not a guru and it was pointed out well and truley by people who had wrecked hundreds of these cars that our book was s*** because we had not. So lets leave that comment were it belongs.

I hope this clears up at least two of your points Dave.

Warren
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The HKTG Garage Offline
#44 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 9:01:44 AM(UTC)
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"This is a very good point, if the carpet is incorrct as you say and it is HT, then under your ruling the car should be classed as modified, then Paul's car would also have to be disqualified."

Why? Pauls carpet was black from memory for a black interior. How could he go wrong? Wether it was genuine or Knox repro, its correct black carpet as opposed to HT Antique Gold in a hk Buckskin Beige interior.
The HKTG Garage. The Home of HK HT HG Holden.
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Warren Turnbull Offline
#45 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 9:04:12 AM(UTC)
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Then you missed one of the faults on Paul's car.

Warren

Edited by user Thursday, 16 September 2010 9:06:55 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified
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The HKTG Garage Offline
#46 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 9:20:45 AM(UTC)
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Is it at fault because it is worn/used original? or repro. From memory it was the correct style. I'm trying to look at my photos but the zoom in isnt too clear. I'm sure as long as it wasnt house carpet or cut/loop pile, it would of been acceptable. More acceptable than HT coloured carpet in a HK?
The HKTG Garage. The Home of HK HT HG Holden.
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dirty davo Offline
#47 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 9:23:53 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by Warren Turnbull
how can a HK have "HT antique gold carpet" when it should have been buckskin beige??????????????
SURELY EVEN YOU KNOW THAT EVERY HK ONLY EVER HAD BUCKSKIN COLOURED TRIM. INCLUDING CARPET? (antique gold wasnt even invented, when hk was out there, dont you agree??????????
HT INTRODUCED ANTIQUE GOLD,,NOT HK? is this correct????????????
please correct me if im wrong therefore shouldnt it have been classed as "a modification"???

This is a very good point, if the carpet is incorrct as you say and it is HT, then under your ruling the car should be classed as modified, then Paul's car would also have to be disqualified.
let alone th black console,chrome scuff plates etc etc

All Sydney cars had Black consoles, irrespective of trim colour. See the road test between the 186S GTS, Pacer, capri and I cannot remember the other car, blue trim black console, as Sydney built car.

Chrome scuff plates is part of Interior finish package.
now look at that fuse box!!!!!!
any under 40thousand mile car shouldnt have even had a fuse touched! let alone rubbed & rubbed a hundred times to have worn more than half th writing away like that one has??????
maan that car musta had some major electrical issues to be worn like that one!!!!!!!!!!! even my crusty rusty ole million mile ute fuse box is less worn than that!!!!!!!!

Cannot comment on that one, but someone may have put a cleaning fluid on it at some stage, who knows.
maybe some brown nosing/favouritism may have been contributed?

I do not understand this, I know Nick and Paul, but would not consider it in any judging. I was not completely involved in the concours judging, I missed part of it due to other judging commitments, but do know both cars reasonably well, to say that Nick's was better on the day, as it was discussed why he won.

To discuss these without the owner's permission would be inappropriate.
cant beleive some things so obvious were overlooked by a "guru like yaself?
regards dirty davo.
shoot me down (by all means if im wrong)
after all, ive only wrecked hundreds of these over last 20+ years i await your reply

I should remind you that I am not a guru and it was pointed out well and truley by people who had wrecked hundreds of these cars that our book was s*** because we had not. So lets leave that comment were it belongs.

I hope this clears up at least two of your points Dave.

Warren
sorry, but this does not PROPERLY ANSWER MY QUESTIONS ASKED?

sure nicks car was th better one, (im not disputing that AT ALL!)
just pointing out that WRONG MODEL COLOURED CARPET IS "AS WRONG AS, & SHOULD HAVE BEEN MOVED TO MODIFIED, JUST LIKE TINTED WINDOWS WERE IN THAT SA CV8 WAS???????????????????????
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#48 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 9:33:02 AM(UTC)
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Ok i better fess up , i have kept it a secret long enough .
Nick Gontas paid me off by giving me free Tenpin bowling lessons and even gave me one of his bowling shirts from his bowling club .(The "300" club )
He shouted me Dutch Pofertjes (mini pancakes) for brekky on saturday with Bananas , ice cream and golden syrup , so that really sealed the deal and swayed me , so i overlooked the carpet and scuff plates and left him in concours class .
I think i will have to step down from the judging for such behaviour. My resignation in writing Warren ! ( i am joking by the way )

Now lets all lighten up , no ones car is perfect nor should we pick unless we can produce something better. All three cars in Concours we stunning and with the limited info on the judging sheets i bet there was not much sepearting them /

Here is my quote for the day .
Striving for excellence motivates you; striving for perfection is demoralizing. ~Harriet Braiker

JVB


www.monaromuscleparts.com

Edited by user Thursday, 16 September 2010 9:39:55 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified
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dirty davo Offline
#49 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 9:35:27 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by Warren Turnbull
Then you missed one of the faults on Paul's car.

Warren
POLLITICAL JARON ASIDE
nick might as well have had a HT GTS bonnet on his hk
would that have been accepted also, just coz it looked like it should of been there????????????
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magnumforce Offline
#50 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 9:47:58 AM(UTC)
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Seriously davo when u present a better car in concourse then and only then can you speak on your personal merits .All the entrants to the nationals should all be congratulated in their efforts to be there with there respective cars . As for The biege Hk , It was the better car on the day . Im sure he will improve it even more when time goes on as will the fabulous Yellow HK.
Water easily removes the writing on those fuse box panels by the way, but i would of thought a guru like yourself with 20 years experience would of atleast known that .

Edited by user Thursday, 16 September 2010 10:03:17 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified
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#51 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 9:56:16 AM(UTC)
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Is that you Dirty Harry (Callahan) Magnumforce or we talking Big Block Chrysler here .
Did he fire six shots or only five?' Well, to tell you the truth, in all this excitement, I've kinda lost track myself . Sudden Impact !

I swear i have seen that Muscle Car logo on some Bowling shirts at the Alley on the Warwick weekend you know !!!

www.monaromuscleparts.com

Edited by user Thursday, 16 September 2010 9:57:29 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified
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dirty davo Offline
#52 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 9:58:05 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by Monaro Muscle Parts
Ok i better fess up , i have kept it a secret long enough .
Nick Gontas paid me off by giving me free Tenpin bowling lessons and even gave me one of his bowling shirts from his bowling club .(The "300" club )
He shouted me Dutch Pofertjes (mini pancakes) for brekky on saturday with Bananas , ice cream and golden syrup , so that really sealed the deal and swayed me , so i overlooked the carpet and scuff plates and left him in concours class .
I think i will have to step down from the judging for such behaviour. My resignation in writing Warren ! ( i am joking by the way )

Now lets all lighten up , no ones car is perfect nor should we pick unless we can produce something better. All three cars in Concours we stunning and with the limited info on the judging sheets i bet there was not much sepearting them /

Here is my quote for the day .
Striving for excellence motivates you; striving for perfection is demoralizing. ~Harriet Braiker

JVB


www.monaromuscleparts.com
i think everyone is missing the point im trying to address!
all i am stating is that"whats good enuff for th goose is good enuff for the gander"!!
if you wanna overlook "ONE FAULT OF ONE VEHICLE", THEN ITS ONLY FAIR IT SHOULD APPLY TO "EVERY OTHER VEHICLE INVOLVED"
ISNT THAT WHAT JUDGING IS ALL ABOUT????????????JVB
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#53 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 10:07:23 AM(UTC)
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I do understand Dave.
But If we were to get like that and look at every nitty gritty point on all parts of these cars , then there would not be any cars in any of the classes just about .
As i keep saying lets get it like the NCRS Corvettes and get some manuals /specs books so people know what they need to achieve, or we are just kidding ourselves with the judging . The currect system is just an overview and does not cover even half of what it should from what i saw .

If i cared enough judging i would help out more , but i have always found it demoralising hence why i did not go to Warwick till the last minute after being hassled by many .
I had a great weekend , but the judging has put a little damper on it . I am all for peoples choice rather than all this picking on cars .

www.monaromuscleparts.com
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dirty davo Offline
#54 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 10:10:51 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by magnumforce
Seriously davo when u present a better car in concourse then and only then can you speak on your personal merits .All the entrants to the nationals should all be congratulated in their efforts to be there with there respective cars . As for The biege Hk , It was the better car on the day . Im sure he will improve it even more when time goes on as will the fabulous Yellow HK.
Water easily removes the writing on those fuse box panels by the way, but i would of thought a guru like yourself with 20 years experience would of atleast known that .
once again im only making a point that HT ANTIQUE gold carpet shouldnt be classified as ORIGINAL HK CARPET in any criterior(NO MATTER HOW GOONTUS IT MAY LOOK!)
OVER AN OUT DIRTY DAVO
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magnumforce Offline
#55 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 10:15:14 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by Monaro Muscle Parts
I do understand Dave.
But If we were to get like that and look at every nitty gritty point on all parts of these cars , then there would not be any cars in any of the classes just about .
As i keep saying lets get it like the NCRS Corvettes and get some manuals /specs books so people know what they need to achieve, or we are just kidding ourselves with the judging . The currect system is just an overview and does not cover even half of what it should from what i saw .

If i cared enough judging i would help out more , but i have always found it demoralising hence why i did not go to Warwick till the last minute after being hassled by many .
I had a great weekend , but the judging has put a little damper on it . I am all for peoples choice rather than all this picking on cars .

www.monaromuscleparts.com


The Corvette NCRS method is the only way to go . the Corvette fraternity are miles ahead regarding the whole judging controversy !!

check it out http://www.ncrs.org/awards.html?uid=5092



Edited by user Thursday, 16 September 2010 10:17:25 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified
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dirty davo Offline
#56 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 10:15:59 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by magnumforce
Seriously davo when u present a better car in concourse then and only then can you speak on your personal merits .All the entrants to the nationals should all be congratulated in their efforts to be there with there respective cars . As for The biege Hk , It was the better car on the day . Im sure he will improve it even more when time goes on as will the fabulous Yellow HK.
Water easily removes the writing on those fuse box panels by the way, but i would of thought a guru like yourself with 20 years experience would of atleast known that .
i really dont think water alone would clean off script to that extent in any life time. realistically anyway????
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magnumforce Offline
#57 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 10:18:35 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by dirty davo
quote:
Originally posted by magnumforce
Seriously davo when u present a better car in concourse then and only then can you speak on your personal merits .All the entrants to the nationals should all be congratulated in their efforts to be there with there respective cars . As for The biege Hk , It was the better car on the day . Im sure he will improve it even more when time goes on as will the fabulous Yellow HK.
Water easily removes the writing on those fuse box panels by the way, but i would of thought a guru like yourself with 20 years experience would of atleast known that .
i really dont think water alone would clean off script to that extent in any life time. realistically anyway????


is that why you call yourself dirty dave ??
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dirty davo Offline
#58 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 10:32:21 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by magnumforce
quote:
Originally posted by dirty davo
quote:
Originally posted by magnumforce
Seriously davo when u present a better car in concourse then and only then can you speak on your personal merits .All the entrants to the nationals should all be congratulated in their efforts to be there with there respective cars . As for The biege Hk , It was the better car on the day . Im sure he will improve it even more when time goes on as will the fabulous Yellow HK.
Water easily removes the writing on those fuse box panels by the way, but i would of thought a guru like yourself with 20 years experience would of atleast known that .
i really dont think water alone would clean off script to that extent in any life time. realistically anyway????


is that why you call yourself dirty dave ??
yea yea man.see ya at perth natts in me crusty rusty ole every day driver ute.!!!!!!!!! nothing at all original on this ole pig an proud of it!!!!!!! i save all the goodies for resale & use up th leftovers to circumnavigate th world
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Warren Turnbull Offline
#59 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 4:33:56 PM(UTC)
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sorry, but this does not PROPERLY ANSWER MY QUESTIONS ASKED?

sure nicks car was th better one, (im not disputing that AT ALL!) just pointing out that WRONG MODEL COLOURED CARPET IS "AS WRONG AS, & SHOULD HAVE BEEN MOVED TO MODIFIED, JUST LIKE TINTED WINDOWS WERE IN THAT SA CV8 WAS???????????????????????

The tint is a non genuine part, unless you can show me genune tint then that shall be reversed. Read the rules, it states aftermarket window tint puts you into modified classs.

So it would be like Nick placing aftermarket plush pile carpet.

If Nick had a HT/G Kingswood bonnet on his car this would attract the attention of the judges and would loose points, but if he had a HT/G GTS bonnet he would be in modified.

If colour of the carpet disqualifies Nick, then Paul would also be disqualified.

I hope that sorts this out for you.

Warren
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70htprem Offline
#60 Posted : Thursday, 16 September 2010 6:15:16 PM(UTC)
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Thanks for the link to the corvette site magnumforce.
The broadest message I found in it all was the judges
as well as all the entrants were there because they wanted to be there.
If every body keeps a cool head, looks to the future and learns from the past then perhaps we could see the upcoming W.A nationals judging take on a more professional approach and not be assembled in the last minute.
Perhaps an earlier tender for judges, with a cut off date. Then a course set up to teach the applicants the finer aspects of being able to go over a car efficiently and fast, and how to fill out their individual reports to hand back to the team leader (overseer) Whom in turn collates and calculates the sheets and hands them to the event organiser. A system if you like.
Nicks fantastic car won the concourse, but concourse is a car sitting in the showroom at the dealer type condition. There are NO dealership transfers glued or sprayed on the vehicle yet NOR are there a bootful of accessories placed in or on the vehicle to distract the buyer from the car. Perhaps Nick should have won the best static display? Concourse most definetely should NOT have been awarded because of these distractions to the would be buyer.
Nicks car therefore is a category onto itself and it's interpretation is so strong that to take or remove any of the cars components would be a shame, as it's historically significant. And its owners contributions to the whole HKTG Monaro movement also leaps into a category itself as a lifetime achievement.
Just my thoughts thats all, and this after all is just gossip :-) Hey, Have fun!
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