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Using a self managed super fund to buy cars
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I went to the accountant the other day about self managed super funds, to actually set one up.
he told me of a guy who used his super to buy Jaguars that were collectable.
under the fund rules, you can't use it as a daily driver, but it is allowed to be shown and "test and tune"
looks like the way to go?.
the annual cost of compliance to the fund was $700.
interesting aye?
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Old holdens brought on the spot, quick decision, cash paid. |
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we have a self managed super fund.... we have bought houses with long term development potential... we have also bought some investment art under the fund....
my wife wont let me buy a car in the fund.... just yet..... and the rules dont allow my current monaro to be sold to the fund... dammit
one thing i will warn you about is the cost of compliance and the auditing costs involved.... unless your super fund has at least $250K in it I would leave it where it is and the annual fund management costs are a few thousand dollars.... food for thought
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i was quoted $2200 for the trustee set up and $700 per year thereafter.
the rules don't allow you to sell stuff to yourself, but you can buy a HQ monaro of someone else....
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-2 14 x 9.25 CSA style Centrelines.
-2 x 15 x 8 Dragway centrelines |
Old holdens brought on the spot, quick decision, cash paid. |
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I posted a similar question on a financial site re: purchasing a lifestyle farm (with huge sheds to collect Holdens of course) - however got not decent replies.
Any financial guru's here that could help explain to us the most tax and financially effective ways to buy a farm (with sheds), industrial complex etc to store, restore and stash cars. Either as a pseaudo business investment (with offsite income) or as self managed super fund.
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I would have thought that a car in a super fund wouldn't work as cars as personal assets are not subject to capital gains tax (or we'd all be making losses), but returns on super fund investments are subject to tax. Plus the basic idea of a Super fund is to create income plus capital growth, like a rental property. However vehicles are 100% capital growth with no income.
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If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords? |
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If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords? |
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Cars can generate income from TV shows and as Hire Cars, the amount of income isnt necessarily large, but could offset some costs and satisfy the income generation rules. A car on club rego would fit the non daily aspect of the rules. Large farms can lease paddocks or fields to other farmers (income), or just run a few beef cattle that can grow from calves and then be sold off. A guy I met when I was in Gunnedah had 400 acres, he said he earned more from breeding and selling parrots than growing crops. Smaller farms can still earn cash from specialised products. Sell the car to a friend on paper then buy it back, it will also reset the capital gains clock.
You only have to be in front at the end of the race. Edited by user Saturday, 22 May 2010 9:31:40 PM(UTC)
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You only have to be in front at the end of the race. |
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Yes Byron, but car yards make money on cars, and they pax tax on that. So Super can invest in art etc. I am not sure how you would go with rego, as it would have to be regoed in the super funds name.
If too many start dong this it can artificially inflate prices and then when some sell the whole thing falls over.
Warren
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Yes, but that is a business making money. Point was why would you transfer a large tax free capital gain prospect away from a personal asset into an environment where you have to pay tax on the gain? From memory the tax is on the asset when it goes into the fund as well as when it leaves? Not sure how that work on a car??
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If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords? |
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If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords? |
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quote:
Originally posted by Holdenon
I posted a similar question on a financial site re: purchasing a lifestyle farm (with huge sheds to collect Holdens of course) - however got not decent replies.
Any financial guru's here that could help explain to us the most tax and financially effective ways to buy a farm (with sheds), industrial complex etc to store, restore and stash cars. Either as a pseaudo business investment (with offsite income) or as self managed super fund.
i used to work as an Agronomist for ELDERS, and we had some clients in that same situation as yours. The Tax office deems you to be a primary producer if your turnover is $20K. At cattle sales, these people would buy $20+K of cattle and sell them on again without them leaving the pen. basically just give elders to commision of sale on the $20K and your a primary producer. Land size has nothing to do with it, as 3 AC OF HYDROPONIC GLASSHOUSE TOMATOES has an imput cost of around $50K / ac / yr |
Old holdens brought on the spot, quick decision, cash paid. |
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[quote]Originally posted by HK1837
I would have thought that a car in a super fund wouldn't work as cars as personal assets are not subject to capital gains tax (or we'd all be making losses), but returns on super fund investments are subject to tax. Plus the basic idea of a Super fund is to create income plus capital growth, like a rental property. However vehicles are 100% capital growth with no income.
In your annual audit, you would estimate your vehicles value
e.g
purchase $50K
12 months $52K
24 months $54K etc etc
my understanding is that you would only be exposed to the 15% super fund tax rate when the car is sold.
so if you sell for $80 K 10 years later, get $20K as cash and write a reciept for $60K.(ok this is dodgey)
therefor you pay tax on $10K ($60K sale-$50K purchase) minus the costs of running the fund for 10 years ($7K) (10 years x $700)
=$3K gain x 0.15% super tax rate
$450 in tax when you sell!!!
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Old holdens brought on the spot, quick decision, cash paid. |
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quote:
Originally posted by adam PERTH
At cattle sales, these people would buy $20+K of cattle and sell them on again without them leaving the pen.
basically just give elders to commision of sale on the $20K and your a primary producer.
On the face of it, this is probably tax evasion and fraud, so I don't understand the point you are trying to make, unless you are endorsing illegal behaviour.
quote:
Originally posted by adam PERTH
3 AC OF HYDROPONIC GLASSHOUSE TOMATOES has an imput cost of around $50K / ac / yr
I'm a little lost as to the purpose of capitalising the words hydro tomatoes - what is the point that you are stressing?
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i accidently hit the caps lock , sorry DCOE.
how was it fraud? they brought them, they sold them?, + paid commission.
have you heard of the Australian Stock Exchange?
same deal. buy and sell shares, + pay commission. |
Old holdens brought on the spot, quick decision, cash paid. |
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quote:
Originally posted by adam PERTH
i accidently hit the caps lock , sorry DCOE.
apology accepted
quote:
Originally posted by adam PERTH
how was it fraud?
intent
quote:
Originally posted by adam PERTH
have you heard of the Australian Stock Exchange?
Yes, I've heard of it. It's completely unrelated to the subject of tax evasion and fraud.
quote:
Originally posted by adam PERTH
they brought them, they sold them?,
No, they bought them. The seller brought them (to market).
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Rank: Veteran
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Old holdens brought on the spot, quick decision, cash paid. |
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quote:
Originally posted by adam PERTH
your awesome
my awesome... what?
you're awesome too mate
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Cattle. Now there something to make money on. Their is a risk but you accept it. If it is old or rare - Cut it! http://www.ehlimo.com.au/ |
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quote:
Originally posted by HK1837
I would have thought that a car in a super fund wouldn't work as cars as personal assets are not subject to capital gains tax (or we'd all be making losses), but returns on super fund investments are subject to tax. Plus the basic idea of a Super fund is to create income plus capital growth, like a rental property. However vehicles are 100% capital growth with no income.
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If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords?
i put the car in super thing to my accountant a couple of years ago and was told dont do it...im pretty sure what byron is describing is along the same lines as i was told.. also i was told that it could only be displayed and it could not be driven or registered. going to church makes you no more a christian than standing in a garage makes you a car... www.classicozwreck.com.au |
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if ya want a car, get the cash and buy it. thats what happened years ago when giovanni and gina came over from the homeland and bought the new EH, they worked, saved, and went and bought the car, none of theis rubbish was even thought of back then, and guess what? they didnt worry bought all the crap you guys are on about, they lived and enjoyed themselves anyways, gotta go, got an appoinment with wayne swan, he wants some advice from me "Reputations are made and broken as soon as you enter or leave my shed.." Edited by user Monday, 24 May 2010 10:52:22 PM(UTC)
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Check your pockets afterwards Frank. I don't know why, but for years (like the last 10 yeears or more) everytime I see Wayne Swan on TV I check my pockets. Guess what I thought when Labor won the last election and he became Treasurer!
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If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords? |
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If we all had the same (good) taste, who would buy all the Fords? |
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Using a self managed super fund to buy cars
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