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Holden and Torana BODY plate question
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Guys
Been having this discussion about ADR plates on Toranas and Holdens over on the GMH Torana forum. Havent had any real answers yet so thought Id post it here too. (I have one lead to follow up on which I will next week).
Question is: What does the semi-random A that appears on some Torana and Holden ADR plate mean. Manifestation examples as below:
LX TORANA COUPE A;
HZ SEDAN A;
HX PANEL VAN A;
LX TORANA SEDAN 4 DOOR A.
So far the A only seems to appear on ADR27A automatic LX, HX, HZ and possibly UC. (I havent studied VB, VC, VH and WB enough to confirm anything about them as yet. I did look at a few VK M40 examples on the weekend and it didnt appear on them).
I havent seen an instance of it on a manual example yet.
So my initial thoughts were it was there (by whatever motivation) to distinguish an ADR27A AUTO vehicle where the engine specification was different between manual and auto. So that means:
LX and UC 6cyl eg HL vs XQL;
LX, HX, HZ V8 manual has no EGR valve and different carb.
Examples found so far seem to point towards this being the case, or at least the A having something to do with auto optioned vehicles. Example vehicles found that support it:
Heaps of LX Toranas (sedan and coupe), autos have A manuals dont.
HZ GTS L31 M41 WITH the A;
HX BO6 van L31 M41 WITH the A;
HX and HZ L20 M40 commercials WITHOUT the A (manual and auto engines identical spec);
Numerous HX and HZ sedan/wagon L20 M40 examples WITHOUT the A (as above);
Many HX and HZ Statesman examples WITHOUT the A (single engine/trans spec).
Examples that go against it (or possibly support the final answer):
HX Kingswood sedan L20 M40 WITH the A (auto and manual 202 should be the same spec??);
UC Sunbird sedan L18 M40 WITHOUT the A (this may be because Sunbird auto and manual engines were the same spec?);
HX van L32 M40 WITHOUT the A;
Application of the A appears across Pagewood, Dandenong and Elizabeth constructed vehicles so far ( I havent recently sighted Acacia Ridge vehicles to check), however plant variation shouldnt affect the ADR plates as these were all stamped at the same place/press.
Anyone have any better ideas or vehicles exhibiting the A to check??
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An obvious question for the esteemed Ben Stewart.
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Nope. Tried that.
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I think youre on the money in regards to the A relating to autos and emissions.
A long shot, but I remember NSW had different emission laws to other States, could this (ie. NSW) be part of the answer?
I have a fading memory or reading something about not being able to buy a 4 speed VK 3.3 in NSW due to it not meeting emission regs, so perhaps there was no need to identify a VK 3.3 auto as a separate entity. This is a bit later than HX//HZ/LX/UC era though. Hmmmm....
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Got me! Unless it was stamped on vehicles ordered with a option pack to upgrade from the base model IE. So they just put a "A".
A UC Sunbird Tory with the option (opt A8J) Made it a SLE.
A UC Tory with the option (opt A9H) Made it a SL.
A TC Gemini with option (opt A8T) made it a SL fashion pack sedan.
A VC Commodore with option (opt A8Q) Made it a HDT
ect ect ect!
I am probably wrong I usually am...lol
Cheers
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I tend to agree with Franklin about NSW having different regulations from 1976 to about 86. So yes it could be a nsw auto trans thing.
Ford had different engine codes for NSW bound vehicles of the era so it stands to reason that Holden would too.
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The NSW differences began on 1st January 1981.
This affected VC Commodores, & WB Holden (& XD Fords), all during the middle of their production run.
One of these differences was the non-availability of VC 3300 with the 4-speed manual option in NSW.
AFAIK there were no differences like this in the 76 to 80 era.
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Had a look through my plate collection there appears to be a certain time frame when the A was added Ill keep looking and see if I can narrow it down. Heres a couple of Statesman with and without.    Ill post the rest in my photobucket album http://s359.photobucket....bums/oo34/mrjones81237/ if any one is interested, havent found any manuals yet. Leroy "Planet earth is the asylum to which the rest of the universe sends its lunatics" Voltaire Edited by user Thursday, 18 June 2009 9:30:01 AM(UTC)
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"Planet earth is the asylum to which the rest of the universe sends it's lunatics"
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Just an update all those tags I have found with an A are earlier than 11/77 anybody got any later ones, and what ADR changed at that time 25A seems to be the only difference?
Leroy
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Good stuff. Those are the first Statesmans I have seen with the A, so that blows my single engine spec theory out the window. ADR25 is anti-theft locks or something like that, not sure about 25A. 25 was introduced in the early 70s from memory.
I still maintain its an auto thing, but why and what it means Im not sure. I thought about A/C as well but I dont think it means aircon as at least a few with the A have not had air on them.
Could it possibly be A for Afternoon shift? Would manuals normally be made during the day and autos at night? Were there two ADR plate shipments (or flights hence flipments!) a day?
Im also yet to see an Acacia Ridge example with the A.
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Heres one I prepared earlier :)  7 or 9/77 Bris HZ GTS M41 "Planet earth is the asylum to which the rest of the universe sends its lunatics" Voltaire |
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I do not have a lot of later model tag pictures but from the few I have I have a
Hammersly iron special order ute.
Adelaide made
8WM80
L20 M40 GV7
7/77 build with the A on the plate
and also a
Adelaide made
HX8WM60 1 ton ute
L32 M40 GV7
7/77 build with the A on the plate.
Cheers Paul.
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I was thinking it may have been a transition from rule 25 to 25A but I have found a plate that is a 25A but still has a A so that blows that idea.
Maybe the guy stamping the plates was from queensland and he said A after everything...."Time to go home A" "Nice day today A"
If the guy was a pirate he might have used a "R" instead. :)
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I think its to do with the carbi codes & quick reference for servicing/mechanics/replacement parts, all auto fitted vehicles HJ LH onwards, that have stromberg Carbs, as the strombergs have "A" codes for autos & manuals are "B". for example HJ 173 auto carbi stamp "A S", 173 manual carbi stamp "M S", 202 auto carbi stamp "A T", 202 Manual carbi stamp "M T", 253 Auto carbi stamp "A W", 253 manual "M W", as for the rochester there is no seperate code for either auto or manual that I could find in the HQ manual, but may be listed in the HK-HT manuals, or it may suggest it only affects cars fitted with stromberg carbs. I also found in the HQ shop manual the carbi is a "BXV-2" for all 6cyl engines (excluding the 130cui), which would explain why the A isnt shown on any HQ tags I have seen. ADR 25 is to do with anti theft door locks & ADR 25A is a revision. HOLDEN The Great Way to Move Edited by user Friday, 19 June 2009 9:24:05 PM(UTC)
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HOLDEN The Great Way to Move |
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quote:
Originally posted by Monaro202
ADR 25 is to do with anti theft door locks & ADR 25A is a revision.
AFAIK its anti-theft locks (not anti-theft door locks). I think it refers to the steering column lock. ADR25 was introduced on 1/1/72 so all cars required a steering lock (or gear-lever lock on some cars). The revision, ADR25A was introduced on 1/1/78, this was when Holden fitted the newer black one-eared ignition lock barrel. Dr Terry |
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ok thats funny, i have a factory 253 manual SL Torana Hatchback thats got LX TORANA COUPE A on the tag, so there go the auto trans theory
the build date is 7/77 if that helps, but it has got me stuffed, every time i look at the tags it always got me thinking "what the hell does that A mean".
Ill get some photos of the tags on here as soon as found that me camera.
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Bugger. Thats the first manual that has come to my attention with an A.
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Another auto Torana with the A on AMCS http://australianmusclec...s.com.au/muscle/127704. I think Eddys tag is a mis-stamp, too many autos for it to be anything else. Leroy "Planet earth is the asylum to which the rest of the universe sends its lunatics" Voltaire |
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I have some numbers off a ute I was looking at buying. Here are the specs:
HX coupe utility A
8-76 AHX01255M
GVW 2155kg Seating cap 3
8M80LFJ535096X
Engine number: QM614863 - I didnt know where to look for the date on a 6, what might the date be? Im not going back to see it for a while, its about an 1.5 hours away.
HX8WM80
535096M
1886-67W
568-15949
ENG L20
TRANS M40
RRAXLE GV4
Chassis number: AHX01255M
Gear Box: K J
Single headlight
No dash or support for dash
Steering wheel was gone and the steering column was hanging down. Probably a column shift auto as it was a 3 seater and I dont recall seeing a floor shift.
Hope this helps A!
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I thought I'd better wrap this up, been a long time.
Prior to the introduction of ADR27A the ADR tag had a 9 on it which was applicable to Auto vehicles. That ADR disappeared around that time (was repealed early 1976) and from around that time onwards the ADR tag sported an A on automatic vehicles. Why, not sure, but it happened. |
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