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Hr X2 identification
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coupe Offline
#1 Posted : Monday, 11 February 2013 6:58:56 AM(UTC)
coupe

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Hi guys I've looked around to try to work out how to id a hr x2. even here on fastlane. Is there any difinative way of telling from an Id plate or is there other ways. From what I can tell you can get all the options and put them on a hr prem and have a "Genuine" X2
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HGV8 Offline
#2 Posted : Monday, 11 February 2013 7:37:26 AM(UTC)
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Original books or sale receipt are the only sure way to I.D.
j.williams
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HGV8 Offline
#3 Posted : Monday, 11 February 2013 7:42:36 AM(UTC)
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X2 should have a k after 186 in the engine number. Should have a full intrument dash, twin stombergs, headers, x2 badge on boot and grill. But your right, these parts can be put on any HR, doesn't make it genuine by putting these parts on though.
j.williams
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Dr Terry Offline
#4 Posted : Monday, 11 February 2013 7:54:01 AM(UTC)
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That's basically correct, the X2 was just an engine option (plus the extra gauges), They was no proper ID on the body plate.

Having said that, many Melbourne built HRs had an an extra line of ID numbers put on the INSERT line of the body plate. It was a 3-digit number, something like 242 or 286 which was like an option package number which signified what options were fitted in the engine/transmission/brake area.

If the car was an original untouched example, a person familiar with HRs could possibly pick an original X2, but equally that same person could built one that a so-called expert may not pick.

There are many small things like the ammeter wiring harness & whether the engine number lines up with the chassis or body numbers etc. etc.

The X2 gauge-set was also available as a separate option (or dealer-fitted accessory) so its presence is no guarantee of the car having had an X2 engine fitted.

Also, you mention Premier, there were also Special & Standard models with the X2 option, although X2 Standards are more rare.

As mentioned above, the original paperwork would be the only proof hard to dispute.

Dr Terry
If at first you don't succeed, just call it Version 1.0
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Dr Terry Offline
#5 Posted : Monday, 11 February 2013 7:59:27 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by HGV8
X2 should have a k after 186 in the engine number. Should have a full intrument dash, twin stombergs, headers, x2 badge on boot and grill. But your right, these parts can be put on any HR, doesn't make it genuine by putting these parts on though.

Jeremy. HR X2s had no X2 grille badge. That was HD X2s. The HR X2s got front guard badges.

Also a 186K was also the prefix for an HR 186S.

Dr Terry
If at first you don't succeed, just call it Version 1.0
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HGV8 Offline
#6 Posted : Monday, 11 February 2013 8:04:07 AM(UTC)
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Whoops, Terry's correct on the "no X2 badge on grill".
j.williams
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HGV8 Offline
#7 Posted : Monday, 11 February 2013 8:09:48 AM(UTC)
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http://www.ebay.com.au/i...d4d&_uhb=1#ht_500wt_1167

This is an example of a HR which owner believes is a genuine X2. I don't believe its genuine and if you use tips above you should be able to work out why.
j.williams
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colt Offline
#8 Posted : Tuesday, 12 February 2013 3:53:37 AM(UTC)
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Yeh, that one looks like a standard 186. As Terry says, when I'm looking at one, HD's especially, the wiring for the ammeter in the engine bay is external to the main loom.

AFAIK only later model HR's had this wiring included as part of the main loom.

To me this is the best way to tell. Not fool proof though.
Colin.
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Dr Terry Offline
#9 Posted : Tuesday, 12 February 2013 4:07:46 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by colt
Yeh, that one looks like a standard 186. As Terry says, when I'm looking at one, HD's especially, the wiring for the ammeter in the engine bay is external to the main loom.

AFAIK only later model HR's had this wiring included as part of the main loom.

To me this is the best way to tell. Not fool proof though.
Colin.

I wasn't aware that any HD or HR had the ammeter wiring incorporated into the main wiring harness.

I'm not 100% sure, but you may have noticed this only on some 'restored' cars.

BTW, you've got to love that 'genuine' HR X2 on ebay, listed above.

Dr Terry
If at first you don't succeed, just call it Version 1.0
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colt Offline
#10 Posted : Tuesday, 12 February 2013 4:33:36 AM(UTC)
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You're right Terry, I forgot about the 186S cars. I think these have the wiring taped? I'm pretty sure this is a late HR (upper seat belt points built in) which means it should be a 186S not X2.

Colin.
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Dr Terry Offline
#11 Posted : Tuesday, 12 February 2013 5:21:15 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by colt
You're right Terry, I forgot about the 186S cars. I think these have the wiring taped? I'm pretty sure this is a late HR (upper seat belt points built in) which means it should be a 186S not X2.

Colin.

I doubt that very much, there was no change to the main wiring harness for the 186 S intro.

BTW, the upper seat belt mounting points came in for the Sept 1 1966 safety upgrade, but the 186 S wasn't seen until mid-June 1967.

Dr Terry
If at first you don't succeed, just call it Version 1.0
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HR2104 Offline
#12 Posted : Tuesday, 12 February 2013 7:37:39 AM(UTC)
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Hi Dr Terry, the ammeter wire is taped within the wiring harness of my original (not restored) 186S (early 1968 Adelaide build) and within the NOS S Eng. auto, RHD wiring harness (part no. 7434348) I have on the shelf. Regards, Keith.
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coupe Offline
#13 Posted : Tuesday, 12 February 2013 8:16:57 AM(UTC)
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Thanks guys and thats the x2 on ebay that I was suspiciuous about, it didnt look quite right to me
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David 67HR Offline
#14 Posted : Friday, 15 February 2013 4:33:12 AM(UTC)
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It isn't an X2, No badging in the right places, no photo's of engine bay to show X2 air cleaner, brake booster or engine number which must be a 186k code.
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Dr Terry Offline
#15 Posted : Friday, 15 February 2013 5:58:45 AM(UTC)
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quote:
Originally posted by David 67HR
It isn't an X2, No badging in the right places, no photo's of engine bay to show X2 air cleaner, brake booster or engine number which must be a 186k code.

I agree, I doubt it's a real X2.

BTW David, a booster wasn't fitted as part of the X2 engine option. It might seem strange these days, but power discs weren't well accepted by some in the mid-60s. There are plenty of X2s around which left the factory with un-boosted 4-wheel drum brakes.

Dr Terry
If at first you don't succeed, just call it Version 1.0
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David 67HR Offline
#16 Posted : Monday, 18 February 2013 7:03:56 AM(UTC)
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Yes you are correct, i have found lots of Premiers and some aleged X2's with drums all round. That "genuine X2" has a 186A engine.
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